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Engine v141, Scripts v305

*SmokeyKilla* The Wolf Spiders Racer Badlands Truckstop Faction Group: Marshals Posts: 224 Joined: Nov 1, 2013 Quote: hmmm... Listening to you guys, I think things may have gotten better for me. Definately has evened up the PVP side of things by a huge amount ......................... vet wv marshal paintball semiprocombat pvp5 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 3:21 am

JS Hitmen Trucking Inc -CI- Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Members Posts: 3,238 Joined: Jan 9, 2010 Juris said: Well at least all those cheater SN8 NPCs just got wacked Those don't do anything.  NPCs don't shoot until 100m, so the sniper could be SN 105 and it just doesn't matter. As I've said before, for PvE, letting the NPCs shoot at a range longer than 100m would have fixed the Sniper problem to a large extent. For PvP, it's just simply not an issue as every player has the chance to build what they want, and shoot when they want.  ......................... vet wv pvp5 pvp3 pvp4 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 3:40 am

Bolt Thrower Quantum Symphony Darkwind Guru Deathrace Mafia Faction Group: Members Posts: 727 Joined: Sep 12, 2013 SmokeyKilla said: Quote: hmmm... Listening to you guys, I think things may have gotten better for me. Definately has evened up the PVP side of things by a huge amount I need to test, but PVE may have gotten easier down south for me also. ......................... vet wv northernsummer1,92,1 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 4:09 am

Bolt Thrower Quantum Symphony Darkwind Guru Deathrace Mafia Faction Group: Members Posts: 727 Joined: Sep 12, 2013 *sam* said: - I also made a change to one of the build settings on the Windows client.. would appreciate hearing whether people think the new engine is more stable/less crashy than the last? Client only works for me if I run as admin. ......................... vet wv northernsummer1,92,1 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 4:11 am

Grimm Sykes Sand xbzyas Darkwind Guru Merchants Faction Group: Banned Posts: 1,372 Joined: Mar 14, 2010 turn off UAC, and by the way, windows XP is discontinued and no longer supported by microsoft ......................... vet wv pvp5 pvp4 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 4:26 am

*SmokeyKilla* The Wolf Spiders Racer Badlands Truckstop Faction Group: Marshals Posts: 224 Joined: Nov 1, 2013 Quote: For PvP, it's just simply not an issue as every player has the chance to build what they want, and shoot when they want.  these changes have made a huge difference to PVP as now there is not such a huge advantage between say def2 vs def8 or sniper3 vs sniper8 as there was before.......agreed yes the higher specced ganger still has an advantage but not even remotely close to the one they did have when specs were stacked ......................... vet wv marshal paintball semiprocombat pvp5 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 4:54 am

*StCrispin* Beasts of the Lair Darkwind Guru Anarchists Faction Group: Marshals Posts: 2,657 Joined: Feb 13, 2012 K1500 said: Start shooting earlier to build accuracy from sustained fire and carry more reloads to compensate for the reduced accuracy building perhaps? Run enemies out a bit more to break up the initial rush? Use more drops and side mounts to further break up enemy attack patterns? What all these tactics have in common is they mean less sitting and shooting (except for strategic purposes) which to my mind is a good thing. Adapt your tactics and builds to compensate for the changes as opposed to trying to get the changes to fit your current strategies. K I don't sit and shoot.  I plow right into the pack and tangle it up (except in Morgan where that gets me killed faster)  Im not sure if this change will have any effect on my playstyle since I commonly don't even start shooting until im at about 65m (unless forced to by accurate AI shots from 90m out) I am a little disappointed that the idea to keep SNP Generalized was used despite the poll showing 66% against that. ......................... vet wv gwped paintladder paintball marshal raceL10,1,0 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 5:27 am

*StCrispin* Beasts of the Lair Darkwind Guru Anarchists Faction Group: Marshals Posts: 2,657 Joined: Feb 13, 2012 First Impressions: Sam something is messed up. I have to Login to the Web site, then Login to the client and then when the client loads it makes me Login a 3rd time with a blank window (or it asks me to create an account 50% of the time) Also it wont save my preferences or let me change the font and turns on the music which I clicked off. The only solution is to only run it in Admin mode which causes the client to automatically close every 30 minutes when it times out (I bet this is some admin mode setting that I don't know how to change though) What did you change that makes this no longer playable in any mode other than Admin? This will cause issues for people playing on computers that they don't have admin rights on. ......................... vet wv gwped paintladder paintball marshal raceL10,1,0 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 6:00 am

*K1500* Big Dumb Object Autodueller Deathrace Mafia Faction Group: Marshals Posts: 394 Joined: Dec 29, 2011 Yeah getting the same as Crisp - which also means that Vent is screwey. Running Win7 myself. Also noticing that the AI are now shooting outside of 100M (which is fine) - but watching X and Braune getting hammered in TX from 160m out. K ......................... vet wv zom circuit1 storm2013 circuit3 marshal pvp2 ped2 pvp4 circuit2 ped1 gwped0,1,0 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 8:15 am Last edited Jul 25, 2014, 8:16 am by K1500

Iron Wraith Iron Wraiths Darkwind Guru Civs Faction Group: Members Posts: 818 Joined: Feb 2, 2009 Weird, didn't know you could run the client in any other mode than with admin rights. This isn't really my preferred option as I worry about something tunnelling through and gaining admin rights. That's why I am running on a dedicated gaming laptop. I am running on Windows 8.0 (spit) and I get crashes less frequently than I did. Before now it was crashing after every travel (last month or so, prior to that it seemed very stable but I wasn't playing as much). ......................... vet wv raceL1 deathrceL1 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 9:04 am

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,780 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 Grimm Sykes said: I got a few guys with MG and SNP 2, they used to hit at 100 meters, now they have trouble at 40. my sniper 3 to sniper 5 guys in cc's are about just as bad now when they used to hit at 130 to 180 meters. and my guy with Hvy.Snp3.RR2.RS is having trouble hitting at 50 meters with a HCR. I'm unhappy about this, not that it should matter much, but i think i'm out till this gets sorted, then i'll decide if i want to play more. On one hand i'd like to help sort this out, on the other i dont want to lose all my stuff i worked to get, and my crews in the process. I had not anticipated changes this drastic, even with the sniper nerf that was intended. The thing to remember is that everyone is equally affected, including NPCs. It will tend to make combats more close-quarters, which will itself make them a bit harder, but it won't make anyone better at hitting than you who previously wasn't (unlike what would have happened if sniper was removed from use for any weapons) ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 10:02 am

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,780 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 StCrispin said: First Impressions: Sam something is messed up. I have to Login to the Web site, then Login to the client and then when the client loads it makes me Login a 3rd time with a blank window (or it asks me to create an account 50% of the time) Also it wont save my preferences or let me change the font and turns on the music which I clicked off. The only solution is to only run it in Admin mode which causes the client to automatically close every 30 minutes when it times out (I bet this is some admin mode setting that I don't know how to change though) What did you change that makes this no longer playable in any mode other than Admin? This will cause issues for people playing on computers that they don't have admin rights on. Where do you run Darkwind from, i.e. what folder? Each version of Windows seems to get more and more restrictive in terms of where applications are allowed to write to (which is probably a good thing overall, but it makes things awkward too). I think this trouble all goes away if you run it from a folder where you have read/write access. For example, use 'My Documents', or use the Desktop. I have actually re-built the setupDarkwind.exe version so that it defaults install to 'My Documents'. ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 10:06 am Last edited Jul 25, 2014, 10:07 am by *sam*

*K1500* Big Dumb Object Autodueller Deathrace Mafia Faction Group: Marshals Posts: 394 Joined: Dec 29, 2011 *sam* said: The thing to remember is that everyone is equally affected, including NPCs. It will tend to make combats more close-quarters, which will itself make them a bit harder, but it won't make anyone better at hitting than you who previously wasn't (unlike what would have happened if sniper was removed from use for any weapons) Good to have confirmation on it's effect on the NPC's. Though I will say I watched X & Braune scouting out in TX and they were getting nailed at 100M or so (93m to be exact). They won the scout and we checked the casualties through the event register - no spec AI with 30-40 gunnery a piece. May have been they simply didn't kill the decent gangers I guess though. K ......................... vet wv zom circuit1 storm2013 circuit3 marshal pvp2 ped2 pvp4 circuit2 ped1 gwped0,1,0 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 10:07 am Last edited Jul 25, 2014, 10:12 am by K1500

*The X Man* Better Off Dead Darkwind Guru Slavers Faction Group: Game Manager Posts: 2,207 Joined: Jul 25, 2012 Yup, they were some tough ol' hombres. S648499, The AI was was pretty accurate from the mid 90 meter range. But these guys hit at least the same as they did before the changes were made. Non-specced gangers should not be that good. The encounter was very challenging and a lot more fun. (So good job in that regard Sam!). There was not much sitting and firing either. A lot of movement was needed as well as tactical posturing. I would like some other players opinions on this event on how well the AI did. I still feel the AI played above their skill levels. ......................... vet wv marshal paintladder zom circuit3 paintball raceL1 race1 pvp4 hammer circuit2 pvp2 circuit1 gwped pvp5 pvp3 pvp1 deathrceL1 triangle1 combatL1 elmsautumn combat1 northernsummer1,3,0 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 10:31 am

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,780 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 *The X Man* said: Yup, they were some tough ol' hombres. S648499, The AI was was pretty accurate from the mid 90 meter range. But these guys hit at least the same as they did before the changes were made. Non-specced gangers should not be that good. The encounter was very challenging and a lot more fun. (So good job in that regard Sam!). There was not much sitting and firing either. A lot of movement was needed as well as tactical posturing. I would like some other players opinions on this event on how well the AI did. I still feel the AI played above their skill levels. There has never been any difference between PCs and NPCs in the code that calculates whether a shot hits. Indeed, the code is unaware of whether a gun is being fired by a PC or NPC. I also just checked in case there is any difference in terms of sustained targeting, but there isn't. ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 10:59 am

*Longo* Longos Merry Men Darkwind Guru Mutants Faction Group: Marshals Posts: 6,659 Joined: Dec 15, 2007 *sam* said: The thing to remember is that everyone is equally affected, including NPCs. It will tend to make combats more close-quarters, which will itself make them a bit harder, but it won't make anyone better at hitting than you who previously wasn't (unlike what would have happened if sniper was removed from use for any weapons) Very true. Example I just had - I had a 181 gunner with Snipe 5 missing at 50 meters vs a Wurzel. I panicked a bit, but then also realized they were missing me also. I won the encounter with no significant worries. ......................... vet combatL1 ped1 paintladder semiprocombat ped2 wv pvp4 pvp1 gwped paintball pvp3 pvp5 slay2013 marshal circuit2 combat1 e2g raceL1 gwextrav gateautumn pvp2 triangle1 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 5:40 pm

*Brunwulf* Wulf Guard Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Marshals Posts: 1,299 Joined: May 17, 2012 Longo said: *sam* said: The thing to remember is that everyone is equally affected, including NPCs. It will tend to make combats more close-quarters, which will itself make them a bit harder, but it won't make anyone better at hitting than you who previously wasn't (unlike what would have happened if sniper was removed from use for any weapons) Very true. Example I just had - I had a 181 gunner with Snipe 5 missing at 50 meters vs a Wurzel. I panicked a bit, but then also realized they were missing me also. I won the encounter with no significant worries. Shame- bad luck Wurzel!  ......................... vet ww wv e2g gwextrav sssc northernsummer gateautumn deathrce1 marshal race1 raceL1 combat1 pvp5 pvp4 pvp3 pvp20,1,0 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 5:45 pm

*The X Man* Better Off Dead Darkwind Guru Slavers Faction Group: Game Manager Posts: 2,207 Joined: Jul 25, 2012 *sam* said: *The X Man* said: Yup, they were some tough ol' hombres. S648499, The AI was was pretty accurate from the mid 90 meter range. But these guys hit at least the same as they did before the changes were made. Non-specced gangers should not be that good. The encounter was very challenging and a lot more fun. (So good job in that regard Sam!). There was not much sitting and firing either. A lot of movement was needed as well as tactical posturing. I would like some other players opinions on this event on how well the AI did. I still feel the AI played above their skill levels. There has never been any difference between PCs and NPCs in the code that calculates whether a shot hits. Indeed, the code is unaware of whether a gun is being fired by a PC or NPC. I also just checked in case there is any difference in terms of sustained targeting, but there isn't. One thing I did not take into consideration was the stress levels of the AI. We all got too used to hitting at range without fail. Once the AI got within 100m, they were so rattled, they couldn't hit accurately from 50m. Even though our characters will not have the range to hit as they used to, it means the AI will have better chances to hit you because their lower stress percent will increase their accuracy percent. After reviewing the recording of the event. I can see how choices made early can really make a difference in the outcome. Shooting early to build purple faster like we used to isn't always the best thing anymore. You purple bar takes longer to increase at ranged NPCs which means more wasted ammo. And we all know what happens when the bullets are gone. Sam, this change did make for a more exciting and challenging game play. There are going to be a lot of players fighting to adapt, but they must realize a change in tactics will be a must to survive. Do not do a rush switch to accommodate. This time, let the dust settle before anything else is done. To the player base, no rush judgements because of 1 or 2 scouts. Take the time to relearn strategies or make new ones. There is a lot more fun out there now instead of the boring hilltop fish in the barrel scenario. Again Sam, thank you for your dedication and hard work and dealing with a difficult player base. But most of all, thank you for giving me that much needed adrenalin rush that has been absent in my veins. ......................... vet wv marshal paintladder zom circuit3 paintball raceL1 race1 pvp4 hammer circuit2 pvp2 circuit1 gwped pvp5 pvp3 pvp1 deathrceL1 triangle1 combatL1 elmsautumn combat1 northernsummer1,3,0 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 6:13 pm

FireFly Anarcho-Pumpkin Privateers Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Members Posts: 5,468 Joined: Mar 3, 2008 I just have to say, how does this make it harder for "New" players? New players generally dont have DD or Sniper 2's ......................... vet wv zom gateautumn deathrceL1 elmsautumn pvp1 pvp2 sssc raceL1 e2g combatL1 santa1 pvp3 gwextrav ww circuit32,18,0 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 6:40 pm Last edited Jul 25, 2014, 6:40 pm by FireFly

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,780 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 Thanks X Man. The feedback from people so far has been very supportive, so I'm hopeful this will have worked well. You are right though, that certain things have been balanced under the assumption of the older system (e.g. the huge CR imbalance you tend to face on some maps may have to revised a little.. but as you said, this is best left until the dust settles) ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Jul 25, 2014, 7:17 pm

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