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vehicle specialisms = permadamaged gear is valuable
*Tinker*
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The Paranoid Tourist said:
The idea of 'negative' vehicle statuses seems just silly to me. What happens, I bring home a vehicle one day and suddenly it's crappier than before? This completely negates the idea of giving players more reasons to keep their old vehicles around when they're banged up a bit. Now we'd have to sell them at a reduced price due to their new-found curse.



You didn't read my post completely, it's not about gaining specialisms


Let me elaborate


It's about discovering your car through use, and no i don't want for my car to be renowned before it becomes cursed! That's no logical

The car had it cards dealt to it from the beginning, it's unique right out the box, you just don't know it unless you pay attention to it every time you scout, after let's say 10-20 scouts, you might get a confirmation

By the time your cars renowned, you might already have 2 confirmed attributes, up to you to keep it if it's a lemon... (i have 2 renowned cars i'm guessing it takes 50 scouts to get to that status? and frankly what does renowned get you anyways in-game)?

In brief it's a way to bring more uniqueness to the game
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vet marshal wv pvp3 zom circuit2 pvp1 cont0,1,0

Posted Oct 29, 2009, 6:10 pm Last edited Oct 29, 2009, 6:14 pm by *Tinker*
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I think I understood you, Tinker. I just don't like it. ;) I'd hate to get that new car of mine that I've been yearning for for months just to find that it's crap because of some impediment or another. And like I said, it goes against the founding idea of this thread, which was to make old cars less likely to be traded off should they get chassis damage.

Tinker said:
and frankly what does renowned get you anyways in-game


Not much, really. Though I wonder if my famed vehicles get shot more by the AI. . .
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Posted Oct 29, 2009, 7:54 pm
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Although I didn't suggest these with the spirit of Tinker's post in mind, I'd be a huge fan of discovering "cursed" and "badly aligned" cars through use.

The soul or personality of the car becoming clearer through use is kinda what I was thinking.


I also suggested a totally insane, overblown doll-house feature that would track each character's emotional state and preferences, like "hates rocket enemies" or "is angry at x ganger right now and doesn't want to ride with them." Strange, semi-arbitrary emotional states of all the gangers would be really... neat.
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vet wv

Posted Oct 29, 2009, 7:58 pm
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Would be strange though to discover your car is actually cursed when all this time it's been saving your gangers' asses in scouts.

simonmaxhill said:
I also suggested a totally insane, overblown doll-house feature that would track each character's emotional state and preferences, like "hates rocket enemies" or "is angry at x ganger right now and doesn't want to ride with them."  Strange, semi-arbitrary emotional states of all the gangers would be really... neat.


I have something like that in mind too. It's one really long, humongous post, but I don't think anyone's ready for it yet, what with all the numerous bugs still unresolved, and the more urgent requested features.
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vet wv zom

Posted Oct 29, 2009, 8:12 pm Last edited Oct 29, 2009, 8:13 pm by Karz Master
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However this goes, just don't have it tied to a car being renowned, unless you are really good, use good skilled gangers, and always roll with an awesome scout, the odds of ever owning a renowned car is, well, unlikely.

I think more than the select few who can keep cars alive long enough should be able to enjoy having "special" cars, hell, I have nothing against a car having negative modifiers, its still my damned car, and I will still drive the damned Peil, or whatever car it might be.
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vet wv zom gateautumn deathrceL1 elmsautumn pvp1 pvp2 sssc raceL1 e2g combatL1 santa11,5,0

Posted Oct 29, 2009, 8:53 pm
*Tinker*
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why do you guys see only the negative? my post was 50% 50% and cursed  [ ok change it to skeachy if you like] was probably the worst of that, you would be pretty happy to get something different would you not?

PT said:
And like I said, it goes against the founding idea of this thread, which was to make old cars less likely to be traded off should they get chassis damage.


Na when i responded i felt it was totally in character with this thread, that was this morning after a good night's sleep, now i'm not sure lol... ok a litle off topic, but the idea was even with bad chassis damage an old car with a lucky roll, or quirks would be harder to let go
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Posted Oct 29, 2009, 9:42 pm Last edited Oct 29, 2009, 9:52 pm by *Tinker*
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FireFly said:
However this goes, just don't have it tied to a car being renowned, unless you are really good, use good skilled gangers, and always roll with an awesome scout, the odds of ever owning a renowned car is, well, unlikely.


I disagree, status for a vehicle can be gained by anybody, all they have to do is not lose vehicle and scout a lot with it.
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vet marshal wv community

Posted Oct 29, 2009, 9:57 pm
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*Grograt* said:
I disagree, status for a vehicle can be gained by anybody, all they have to do is not lose vehicle and scout a lot with it.


Disagree, sounds like grinding
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Posted Oct 29, 2009, 10:00 pm
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goat starer said:
because mech type changes should be possible just with enough cash.


Not necessarily if it can be implemented in such a way that you can only assign one mech to only one vehicle. It will be more of a time sink than a money sink.

Furthermore let's say this system makes research and developing your vehicle almost impossible for mechs without a minimum skill requirement, like say 80 skill - and bear in mind that is the minimum requirement so it will still take a long time. This means you can't just constantly spam $1000 at the tavern and assign each mech to one vehicle.

Hypothetically, let's suppose there is a max limit of only 5 "specialisms" for the vehicle, and each subsequent specialism takes longer and longer to research - supposing that if this idea were really implemented, even a mech with 150 skill will not be able to research the 4th specialism within 2 months. Ideally gangs with good mechs are likely to have only 2 specialisms, if not 3 optimally when considering all the different constraints like time.

Based on an idea such as this, it's possible to predict that eventually all vehicles will, in the long run, be able to accumulate up to the max limit of 5 specialisms - but I reckon it will require your mech clocking in at least 8 months of accumulated game time.

To further tip the scales of weighing resources vs risk, once the mechanic assigned to work on this stops working on it (in the event he dies or leaves the town or for some reason you just want him to stop working on it), then any progress from the nth to the (n+1)th specialism (where n = {1,2,3,4}) will be cancelled. You will still be retained with the n number of specialisms, but you need to re-assign the mechanic in order to get another subsequent spec.
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vet wv zom

Posted Oct 30, 2009, 3:28 pm Last edited Oct 30, 2009, 3:45 pm by Karz Master
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*Tinker* said:
*Grograt* said:
FireFly said:
However this goes, just don't have it tied to a car being renowned, unless you are really good, use good skilled gangers, and always roll with an awesome scout, the odds of ever owning a renowned car is, well, unlikely.


I disagree, status for a vehicle can be gained by anybody, all they have to do is not lose vehicle and scout a lot with it.


Disagree, sounds like grinding


It's really not grinding. If you like the car you'll use it. If you don't you won't want specs for it, anyway.

Furthermore, you don't have to scout to get a renowned vehicle. I've got a renowned hotrod which has never left SS. . . unless my gangers put guns on it and took it out when I was sleeping. . .

And, FF, you're wrong on most counts. You have to be good, yes, but you should be to achieve a perk like this. Gangers aren't as important as tactics, and scouts are a handicap at best. I think that most people know that I don't bother with scouting skill much at all, certainly not when on a scout. (That sounds weird, but I think you'll follow).

Oh, and a cursed vehicle isn't my cursed vehicle, it's a cursed pile of scrap and parts. Hopefully the dismantling is close enough to an exorcism.
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Posted Oct 30, 2009, 3:39 pm
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A minor and rather intriguing idea regarding cursed vehicles - a car that has had X passengers die whilst riding in it will be labelled as "cursed". Given the normal way of life in Evan, this might need to be a moderately high number! There are no *obvious* game effects from this status - just the status itself, though perhaps an effect on gang morale/courage would be reasonable. Whether such cars would sell for more or less on the market I don't know!

Curses would be "lifted" when a car is scrapped or sold to Jake's/etc. Successful scouts would also remove curses (say, surviving ten scouts unscathed would negate one death).
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vet wv

Posted Oct 30, 2009, 4:47 pm
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simonmaxhill said:

I also suggested a totally insane, overblown doll-house feature that would track each character's emotional state and preferences, like "hates rocket enemies" or "is angry at x ganger right now and doesn't want to ride with them."  Strange, semi-arbitrary emotional states of all the gangers would be really... neat.


I actually have a system for this sort of thing half-sketched out already. I shelved it at the time due to other priorities.
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Posted Oct 30, 2009, 5:54 pm Last edited Oct 30, 2009, 5:57 pm by *sam*
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Simon's thread is stickied but not mine D:
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vet wv zom

Posted Oct 31, 2009, 2:15 am
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*Tinker* said:
*Grograt* said:
I disagree, status for a vehicle can be gained by anybody, all they have to do is not lose vehicle and scout a lot with it.


Disagree, sounds like grinding



what a bunch of tosh.. i had a renowned car shortly after they appeared because i used limiting factor a lot... it didnt take any great effort.. i now have lots of renowned or famous vehicles.. everyone gets them in the end
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Posted Oct 31, 2009, 2:27 am
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Well, I like the idea of them coming with their "attributes" out of the box, but when it comes down to it, I think it should be based on scouts survived.

As in, after a car has survived a total of 20 - 30 scouts, it will gain 1 positive perk (Randomly assigned), the next one comes at double whatever the previous number was, in this case 40 - 60 scouts more and so on, to balance it out, escaping from a battle would have a negative effect of about -2 scouts

Truces would do nothing, while "winning" a travel would give you half a scout, escaping a travel would have no effect.

Negative perks would be based on the amount of times (lets say 10, then it doubles) the car has taken internal damage, and I mean any internal damage, collisions included, unlucky mortar hits included, basically, anything other than armor damage.

This is an easy system that should work, and again, it needs to be random.

__________________________________________________________

The same could apply to race cars, but now, its based on your positioning, 3rd would give half a "point", second a point and first 2 points, based in the same system, the specs gotten would be racing based.

Negative points and specs in the races would be given from resigning from races and placing in the 2 last spots

Deathracing would be a combination of the two.

There, perfectly fine system worked out, maybe tweak the numbers a little bit, otherwise, there you go.

So, if you read all that, thanks for reading it, and what do you think?

(by the way, I think the numbers for the specs should be quite clear, as in, 25 scouts for the spec, just like with characters)
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Posted Oct 31, 2009, 2:37 am Last edited Oct 31, 2009, 3:20 am by FireFly
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Bytten said:
A minor and rather intriguing idea regarding cursed vehicles - a car that has had X passengers die whilst riding in it will be labelled as "cursed". Given the normal way of life in Evan, this might need to be a moderately high number! There are no *obvious* game effects from this status - just the status itself, though perhaps an effect on gang morale/courage would be reasonable. Whether such cars would sell for more or less on the market I don't know!

Curses would be "lifted" when a car is scrapped or sold to Jake's/etc. Successful scouts would also remove curses (say, surviving ten scouts unscathed would negate one death).


This sounds like a very cool idea.

But I'd also like to see it translated as part of the 4X experience in DW too, to further expand the "Xpand" part of 4X. So.....hmmm...maybe two prongs to this aspect - one as what Bytten mentioned, the other through more usage/mech R&D as mentioned by the rest in this thread?
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Posted Oct 31, 2009, 9:01 am
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Definitely good ideas being thrown around in this thread. I like the idea of cars having some kind of possible 'destiny' associated with them at creation however if this attribute gets implemented, I believe that out of 100 cars created, only a very small portion should have the potential of being 'cursed' and a small portion should have the potential of being 'special'.

The mechanism behind vehicles gaining specialisms should be a combination of things. Age of a vehicle, miles traveled, damage taken, internal damage taken, people killed while inside, scouts won, scouts lost, fame of a gang are all possible factors in determining how a car could gain specialisms. I agree that it shouldn't be a purely grindable effect and the age of a vehicle will limit the grind gain.

Cars with specialisms would go a long way towards making a permadaged car much more desirable as it's chassis declines.
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Posted Dec 23, 2009, 7:38 pm
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I think this thread deserves a bump.
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vet wv zom

Posted Jan 14, 2010, 9:18 pm
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I like a lot of these ideas... I don't care for an assigned Mech or anything like that, I only have a couple good ones at any one time because I lose too many people, so I'd probably never see that feature, but I do have a chance of one of my cars surviving long enough to show some sort of attribute- I mean, I suck, but I have at least a few characters with one or more specializations, I would think my oldest cars might begin to show similar progress.

As far as "cursed", maybe the attribute should be a little bit more balanced- in the sense that there is a net gain of zero... for example, instead of "blind" where the car's guns only tend to miss more from a distance, what if while that was true, the guns also hit just a little harder when they _did_ hit- and this would be the sort of trait a FT or Ram car might roll into. Similar for vehicles that get breached a lot- perhaps they also make the crew harder to demoralize because the crew thinks of themselves as having nothing to lose, since they are likely to die anyway... stuff like that, where it's not really a handicap but still gives more flavor...
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vet wv

Posted Jan 30, 2010, 2:08 am
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I was really interested to read this thread, even as a noob, because I immediately noticed a "throw-away" culture in DW, and whilst I benefit quite nicely, it doesn't quite tie in with the "it is the apocalypse, there are no Motor vehicle producing giants anymore".
An idea I had, very much based off this thread was the concept of Vehicle synergy.

Bubba has '12 Sunbeam. He uses it near constantly for league races and town runs.
Bubbas sunbeam "earns" a bit better handling. or better braking. Or more controllable powerslides.
Bubba's good friend rides shotgun. He likes to shoot a hell of a lot of things with the twin gats, the chance to pierce armour whilst using Guns in Bubbas sunbeam increases, why? Familiarity. You have a car. the day you edge it out of the showroom, your'e reluctant as hell. 2 years later, your'e reversing out of your driveway at 80 and turning into your direction of travel with a 220 degree spin.
You get behind a shooter long enough, you learn how it handles, where the recoil will take you, how your path of travel affects your aim.
I'd like to see it as specific bonuses for specific drivers in specific cars. Not really grindable. but enough to keep those precious permadamaged wheels in the garage.
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vet

Posted Mar 3, 2010, 10:26 pm
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