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Karz Master Alpha Junkers Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Storytellers + IP Posts: 2,375 Joined: Nov 13, 2006 I've been an eager beaver for the last few weeks on KS projects. I've backed fiction projects, games and tabletop games. And in my opinion, based on observing various successful and non-successful KS projects, is that while there are several elements that affect the success of a project, its success does not hinge in a static pattern of these elements. Some successful projects bank on one set of marketing strategies, while others bank on another. These elements include: Good marketing skills requires good people skills, which can be signaled in a good video and well-designed KS page. The presentation of a video cannot give the impression of a bored person pitching his product. The speaker must be enthusiastic. The Kickstarter page must also give a detailed description of what to expect, and what's been done. Nobody clicks on a KS page and says "I'm going to spend 20 minutes to read this carefully." Usually they either get excited or they don't, based on first impressions. Prototype showcase. In addition to good marketing skills, Kickstarters that gain the most popularity are either spearheaded by popular figures in the industry, or those with prototypes to show. Since Sam's project will likely belong to the latter, it means that there must be a prototype of sorts to show to the public. Darkwind can act as a demonstration, but ultimately it's an analogue, not a representation. The best way to promote the project is to have a prototype. See: Nekro. Word of mouth is probably the most important factor because that's where the money's going to come from, ultimately. I've seen projects fail because of inconsistent spreading of the word. A project can gain overnight popularity when all the right notes are hit *simultaneously*. See: FTL. Regular updates. I've seen projects that have failed to gather excitement, in addition to slow word of mouth, because of irregular updates. Regular updates are needed to keep people excited and something to look forward to. Updating the reward tiers constantly also add value to project, and give people who are on the fence a push. It's a psychological game. See Sherlock Holmes Consulting Detective as an example of good potential with awfully slow updates; or Nekro as an example of regular updates leading to its popularity. Reasonable, realistic goals must be set to show the developer has thought this through. People are suffering from KS burnout, after seeing so many crap projects with unrealistic goals. It's too easy to dismiss a project now. Having a realistic goal signals that the developer is (a) not just begging for money and (b) is willing to commit money from his own pocket. Did I miss anything else? Feel free to add on to that list. Let's help make Sam's project a success. It's now or never - either it picks up momentum right from the get-go, or it faces the risk of elimination. Also, first post! ......................... vet wv zom Posted Apr 28, 2012, 11:39 am Last edited Apr 28, 2012, 11:42 am by Karz Master

*Tinker* BibleThumpers Anonymous Darkwind Guru Mutants Faction Group: Marshals + Contributors Posts: 4,546 Joined: Aug 1, 2008 Apparently the company needs to be based in the USA to get on KS ......................... vet marshal wv pvp3 zom circuit2 pvp1 cont Posted Apr 28, 2012, 12:14 pm

Karz Master Alpha Junkers Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Storytellers + IP Posts: 2,375 Joined: Nov 13, 2006 The alternative is to use Indiegogo, which works just as well, even if less popular. ......................... vet wv zom Posted Apr 28, 2012, 12:28 pm

Groove Champion The Groove Champions Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Members Posts: 4,813 Joined: Sep 16, 2008 I'd hate to see Dark Wind fall short of its funding goals if Sam gave Indiegogo/Kickstarter a try: it seems to me like trying to get funded is a one-shot deal. No mistakes can be made! ......................... vet combatL1 wv cont0,5,0 Posted Apr 28, 2012, 3:04 pm

*JeeTeeOh* Loose Cannons Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Marshals Posts: 1,796 Joined: Oct 18, 2010 Seems to me that the key guy who's not real interested in this kickstarter thing is Sam. Heck, I could be wrong, but I think he's pretty happy with this "little" game as it is. So am I. I'd wager so are quite a few of the other players. Why the obsession with bigger-faster-more? ......................... vet wv e2g marshal cont deathrceL1 sssc Posted Apr 28, 2012, 3:35 pm

FireFly Anarcho-Pumpkin Privateers Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Members Posts: 5,468 Joined: Mar 3, 2008 Sam said several time over the last month that he would like to so both a sequel and sp spinoff if he can find time/money ......................... vet wv zom gateautumn deathrceL1 elmsautumn pvp1 pvp2 sssc raceL1 e2g combatL1 santa1 pvp3 gwextrav ww circuit32,18,0 Posted Apr 28, 2012, 5:18 pm

Fifth Fifth Legion Autodueller Renegade Group: Members Posts: 480 Joined: Jan 3, 2010 Per a single-player spinoff - DW:Tactical scenarios could be a good way to beta-test and fine-tune single player scenarios. And I definitely have some ideas for those. Here's one: A Firetruck, armed to the teeth, facing wave after wave of attacks until it either gets to the safety of town, or dies. ......................... vet wv Posted Apr 28, 2012, 5:34 pm

FireFly Anarcho-Pumpkin Privateers Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Members Posts: 5,468 Joined: Mar 3, 2008 If he does make a singleplayer one, take the oppertunity to balance out weapons and specs. Just sayin', proper balance never gets right with only a man or two on it. ......................... vet wv zom gateautumn deathrceL1 elmsautumn pvp1 pvp2 sssc raceL1 e2g combatL1 santa1 pvp3 gwextrav ww circuit32,18,0 Posted Apr 28, 2012, 6:37 pm

Karz Master Alpha Junkers Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Storytellers + IP Posts: 2,375 Joined: Nov 13, 2006 *JeeTeeOh* said: Seems to me that the key guy who's not real interested in this kickstarter thing is Sam. Heck, I could be wrong, but I think he's pretty happy with this "little" game as it is. So am I. I'd wager so are quite a few of the other players. Why the obsession with bigger-faster-more? Believe me, Sam's as excited as a giddy schoolboy experiencing his first crush right now FireFly said: If he does make a singleplayer one, take the oppertunity to balance out weapons and specs. Just sayin', proper balance never gets right with only a man or two on it. The real question - and this entirely hinges on Sam's decision - is what would an SP phase-based car combat wargame entail? I will back whatever Sam comes up with, but if it's going to be Darkwind Tactical without an Internet connection, I doubt others will be all over it. Will it have mod tools? A completable singleplayer campaign? What is the metagame aspect going to be like? ......................... vet wv zom Posted Apr 28, 2012, 7:19 pm Last edited Apr 28, 2012, 7:22 pm by Karz Master

*Tinker* BibleThumpers Anonymous Darkwind Guru Mutants Faction Group: Marshals + Contributors Posts: 4,546 Joined: Aug 1, 2008 Is a DW2 MMO even a possibility?, if so then a 100% client game would rock, that served on a new game engine ......................... vet marshal wv pvp3 zom circuit2 pvp1 cont Posted Apr 28, 2012, 8:14 pm

*StCrispin* Beasts of the Lair Darkwind Guru Anarchists Faction Group: Marshals Posts: 2,657 Joined: Feb 13, 2012 For as much gaming experience as I have... Which is a decent enough amount that most people I know think im an expert (but I know better! lol) I can say ive never heard if KS, indiegogo, of any of the games mentioned in the first post. Other than FTL which I heard from a few sources was a total waste of a game. I never tried it. What would a kickstarter BE? A funded DW mmo or a single play offline game? I know what makes games addictive to me. Addictive nature of a game fuels continued sales of expansions and sequels most definatly. Sims, Civilization (2 of my all time favorites) all got me to keep buyong even though the latest incarnations of both are pretty lousy in comparison to their predacessors. Will add some musings on what makes a game addictive to me when im not attempting tp do this on my phone. ......................... vet wv gwped paintladder paintball marshal raceL10,1,0 Posted Apr 28, 2012, 10:04 pm

FireFly Anarcho-Pumpkin Privateers Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Members Posts: 5,468 Joined: Mar 3, 2008 Karz Master said: FireFly said: If he does make a singleplayer one, take the oppertunity to balance out weapons and specs. Just sayin', proper balance never gets right with only a man or two on it. The real question - and this entirely hinges on Sam's decision - is what would an SP phase-based car combat wargame entail? I will back whatever Sam comes up with, but if it's going to be Darkwind Tactical without an Internet connection, I doubt others will be all over it. Will it have mod tools? A completable singleplayer campaign? What is the metagame aspect going to be like? Yeah, for one it would have to be a much more focused game I think... Smaller gang size by far, take out the time consuming elements like travel times and such... More focus on individual characthers rather than a large gang? ......................... vet wv zom gateautumn deathrceL1 elmsautumn pvp1 pvp2 sssc raceL1 e2g combatL1 santa1 pvp3 gwextrav ww circuit32,18,0 Posted Apr 28, 2012, 10:13 pm

*goat starer* Special Circumstances Darkwind Guru Evan Reds Faction Group: Contributors Posts: 10,908 Joined: Oct 29, 2007 scams scams scams loverrrrrllly SCAMS! ......................... vet wv zom pvp4 cont community deathrceL1 marshal pvp3 pvp2 Posted Apr 28, 2012, 10:52 pm

*Bastille* Raging Scavengers Darkwind Guru Evan Reds Faction Group: Marshals + Contributors Posts: 7,513 Joined: Mar 31, 2009 Community supporter! what a load of... yeah, I think you could be right there. Who was that Tomo Edison bloke? ......................... marshal vet wv pvp4 zom cont pvp32,12,1 Posted Apr 28, 2012, 11:15 pm

Silvra Infinite Justice Sunday Driver Renegade Group: Members Posts: 26 Joined: Jan 11, 2012 I'd definitely kick in. Mostly to get a real, actual full game client and take out the browser aspect. The biggest marketing issue darkwind has, imo, is people don't give it a fair shake before writing it off. I posted about this on a forum I frequent, and most people's reactions were "This looks dumb" due to a combination of the graphics and the browser based stuff. I'm not personally sure how to fix this. It's difficult to convey the tenseness a hairy return has without investing time in the game. My roommate tends to hate "indie" games like minecraft and others, but loves this just because it gives you stuff you can't get anywhere else, namely a fun RPG with real tenseness and a sense of loss. Also shooting a buggy with 6 car cannons and a pair of RLs. Darkwind's injury descriptions, I think, are its hidden gem--who doesn't love running over some ped and seeing "What was once Joel Omalley's head is crushed"? Looking at other games that are as obtuse but became popular, like EVE--a big part of that was the crazy meta mystique that arose with stories like "the big scam". That conveyed the great potential EVE had, and drew more people to the game than any banner ad ever could. Of course, playing the game is more boring than DW ever could be, but it sort of illustrates how you can quickly convey the best parts of a meta game like that. Maybe someone needs to write "The big Return" for DW, heh. The point is, if you're going to do a KS, you have to grab people. Right now, this game doesn't. I really don't want to blame sam or anything, because he's just one guy and is doing the best he can. But little things like the graphics and the browser based nature are what's making people look at the game and turn off to it. If you're planning to do a KS, it might be worth it to spend some time building a tech demo of what it -could- be like, playing down that aspect so people can get to the great meat this game has. Oh, the subscriber thing probably doesn't help. I'd change that for sure. If I hadn't paid for my roommate's first sub, he wouldn't be playing right now. Making the whole SS area f2p would go worlds towards that, and also maybe giving the first spec at 25 so that new players feel a bit more engaged early--right now it can take weeks to get to 50 alone as a new player. Even if it's just the first 5 hires that get a free spec. You'd clearly have to give more people a reason to scout outside SS if you made SS totally F2P, which would probably mean revamping elms so it has more rare chassis more often...but now we're getting into super third rail opinion area. ......................... wv vet Posted Apr 29, 2012, 7:45 am Last edited Apr 29, 2012, 7:50 am by Silvra

Djihani Rollovers Darkwind Guru Deathrace Mafia Faction Group: Members Posts: 899 Joined: Jun 26, 2009 That's total bull#### Silvra. I come to this game because of the graphics and the interface. Kids today probably wont, and I'm totally fine with that There are plenty of games with super graphics that are so complicated there's no chance whatsoever of adding user content and artist salary is so high you get fewer guns/cars/cool stuff depending of how much $$ they have to sink into GFX. (example - fallout 3, had like one assault rifle, one pistol, one or two of everything) If SS would be free to play there would be almost no reason to sub at all IMHO. In my opinion adding story and the mechanics to convey it would be the best addition in a single player mode. Dunno, more than just generic (do x to y) stuff. Like you start off as one or two characters in trouble of some sort, fight your way out of it and gain cool stuff, skills and members along the way as you save the world/ gain more power and area control/ whatever would be the central red line of the story... ......................... vet wv zom gateautumn raceL1 deathrceL10,4,0 Posted Apr 29, 2012, 11:17 am

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,781 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 *JeeTeeOh* said: Seems to me that the key guy who's not real interested in this kickstarter thing is Sam. Heck, I could be wrong, but I think he's pretty happy with this "little" game as it is. So am I. I'd wager so are quite a few of the other players. Why the obsession with bigger-faster-more? I'm definitely interested in trying indiegogo to assist the development of a new single player version (using a different game engine). It's unrealistic to try to raise enough $ to cover a new MMO version. I'll post my ideas in here when I have them written down. I'll definitely be looking for feedback/input from you guys, as well as some testimonials to put on the indiegogo page. ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Apr 29, 2012, 5:04 pm Last edited Apr 29, 2012, 5:07 pm by *sam*

*Tinker* BibleThumpers Anonymous Darkwind Guru Mutants Faction Group: Marshals + Contributors Posts: 4,546 Joined: Aug 1, 2008 Silvra said: Oh, the subscriber thing probably doesn't help. I'd change that for sure. If I hadn't paid for my roommate's first sub, he wouldn't be playing right now. Making the whole SS area f2p would go worlds towards that, and also maybe giving the first spec at 25 so that new players feel a bit more engaged early--right now it can take weeks to get to 50 alone as a new player. Even if it's just the first 5 hires that get a free spec. You'd clearly have to give more people a reason to scout outside SS if you made SS totally F2P, which would probably mean revamping elms so it has more rare chassis more often...but now we're getting into super third rail opinion area. I like this idea a lot ......................... vet marshal wv pvp3 zom circuit2 pvp1 cont Posted Apr 29, 2012, 5:58 pm

Karz Master Alpha Junkers Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Storytellers + IP Posts: 2,375 Joined: Nov 13, 2006 *sam* said: *JeeTeeOh* said: Seems to me that the key guy who's not real interested in this kickstarter thing is Sam. Heck, I could be wrong, but I think he's pretty happy with this "little" game as it is. So am I. I'd wager so are quite a few of the other players. Why the obsession with bigger-faster-more? I'm definitely interested in trying indiegogo to assist the development of a new single player version (using a different game engine). It's unrealistic to try to raise enough $ to cover a new MMO version. I'll post my ideas in here when I have them written down. I'll definitely be looking for feedback/input from you guys, as well as some testimonials to put on the indiegogo page. Don't forget to inform the more professional reviewers that you have contact with, like Bytten. That will really help. ......................... vet wv zom Posted Apr 29, 2012, 6:21 pm

*Tinker* BibleThumpers Anonymous Darkwind Guru Mutants Faction Group: Marshals + Contributors Posts: 4,546 Joined: Aug 1, 2008 for a single player how about possibility of uploading your gang to the MMO when your done? ......................... vet marshal wv pvp3 zom circuit2 pvp1 cont Posted Apr 29, 2012, 7:00 pm

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