Ped Equipment Suggestions
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*sam* Posted May 10, 2009, 10:20 am |
I plan to soon implement a system for arbitrary types of small equipment to be used by peds. Please post your ideas here, along with suggestions for their implementation rules.
Stuff like: flak jackets, helmets, medikits, mechanic's toolboxes, camping/survival equipment, food, binoculors, hand-deployed mines. |
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jeansberg Posted May 11, 2009, 6:33 pm |
Spikemats would be cool. Or just droppable spikes that could be handled the same way as for cars. | ||||||
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*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted May 11, 2009, 6:40 pm |
Binoculars - allows the placement of flag with a distance figure, can be used in a vehicle by an unassigned gunner going under 30 mph
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simonmaxhill Posted May 11, 2009, 7:03 pm |
I don't know if it is exactly "ped" equipment, but I'd love to see trained animals (dogs, mutant rats, klingons) that you could have in the car that'd help detect/fight off the wilderness.
Plus you could eat it in a pinch. |
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darthspanky Posted May 11, 2009, 7:21 pm |
perhaps we could allow for limited non weapon bulk the ped can carry, or will there be a set bulk and for all ped equipment weapons and extras?
would be good if plenty of these items were available at markets so a those with hero points dont buy em all up and all players can buy them without worring about markup on player markets. |
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Whiskey Posted May 11, 2009, 7:45 pm |
The amount of weight that a ped can carry should vary by their Strength. I suggest something like (square root of Strength) x 10. A Strength 25 ganger could carry 50 lbs. A Strength 81 ganger could carry 90 lbs. etc.
The bulk that a ped can carry should be relative constant. It doesn't really matter how strong you are or how light the object. A large awkwardly shaped objects uses up your bulk carrying capacity. Don't believe it. Think about carrying a suitcase with 20 lbs of sand. Now think about how big a box it would take to hold 20 lbs of styrofoam packing peanuts. Backpacks and/or equipment harness increase your bulk carrying capacity by slinging some of the bulk out of interference with your arms/legs/vision/etc. Armor is bulky if carried but not so bulky if worn. I'll let somebody else figure out the relative bulks of the following items depending on whether the item is cargo, carried in a backpack, or considered part of a ped's standard load. Personal Armor: Non-ablative. Helmet: 3 lbs. Absorbs 1 point of damage for head hits. Flak Jacket: 6 lbs. Absorbs 1 point of damage for torso hits Body Armor: 12 lbs. Absorbs 1 point of damage for a hit anywhere on the body including the head. Medical Equipment: The more skilled a medic is to start, the more advantage medical supplies provide. A surgeon with a pocket knife, a bottle of whiskey, and some bandages is better than a know-nothing with a full surgical suite. FA kit: 3 lbs. Boosts the FA skill of the user by 30%. For example: A ganger with FA 50 would perform as if they were FA 65. Doctor's Bag: 9 lbs. Boosts the FA skill of the user by 50%. Mechanic's toolboxes: By default, all cars must have some minimal tools. How else to we manage looting now? A more elaborate mechanic tool box would allow for more flexibility in what could be done in the field. Mechanic Kit: 12 lbs. Allows a mechanic to pull weapons from cars with badly damaged engines rather than having to drive a 5% engine back just to recover an intact weapon. Also, improves the Jury-Rigging result maybe by some bonus similar to what was suggested for FA? Armor Kit: 25 lbs. Allows a mechanic to pull armor plate (scrap metal) off a junk loot car and field patch armor on a keeper. Add 3 points of armor (subject to max armor limits) to one side of a vehicle. Camping/survival equipment, food, water: Assumes that Footsquads will have to start carrying supplies? Survival Pack: 15 lbs. Two days supply of water and food plus miscellaneous suvival items. Halves the amont of radiation poison picked up from being in the wilderness. Binoculors: Provide some small boost to scouting skill similar to how a medikit boosts FA. |
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Joel Autobaun Posted May 11, 2009, 8:57 pm |
Just put TKW in charge of this I like everything he says on this topic. | ||||||
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*Tinker* Posted May 11, 2009, 10:31 pm |
would add that it would extend the return arrival time, to use sparingly when scouting with others also instead of the armor kit, how about using scrap metal in conjunction with the Mechanic kit.... or is that too complicated? (needing to bring scrap metal on travels eating precious bulk space) And I like all your ideas, they sound legit and would add a lot to game play |
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Jaguar Posted May 12, 2009, 7:55 pm |
Emergency flares/kit/radio - may have a small chance of bumping into traders and getting a ride home after a failed scout.
Sunscreen! Bribe Coupon - chance for positive rep groups to truce pirates. More effective when the group is healthy. Peace Voucher - chance for negative rep groups to truce traders. More effective when the group is injured. |
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*sam* Posted May 12, 2009, 7:58 pm |
Or of being gunned down by a gang of pirates masquerading as traders? 
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Jaguar Posted May 12, 2009, 8:06 pm |
Well yes, there must be a risk for the benefit.  More generalized, it would increase the chances of a return encounter but allow for the possibility of a friendly one.
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Whiskey Posted May 13, 2009, 3:48 pm |
For Sam and the Rules Council Consideration, I have refined some of my original ideas. So, here goes.
With additional equipment and the possibility of having to carry survival supplies in Footsquads, I propose the following weight and bulk carrying rules. Weight Carry Capacity equals (square root of Strength) x 10, round results off. A Strength 25 ganger could carry 50 lbs. A Strength 81 ganger could carry 90 lbs. etc. While a ganger might be able to lift and move more than this amount of weight (turning a car over for example), they can not carry more than this for any significant distance. Backpacks and similar items might increase the bulk a character can carry but these items do not increase weight capacity. Bigger people can carry more bulk just because they have larger hands, longer arms, etc. However, this does not scale up very quickly. Base Bulk Carry Capacity equals (square root of Weight Carry Capacity), round results off. Thus a character with 55 strength could carry up to 74 pounds with up to 9 bulk. Base Bulk Carry Capacity assumes the ganger is sticking a few items in their pockets and carrying the rest in their hands. Rifles (shotguns, SMG) are slung over the shoulder by a carry strap which still uses up some of the Base Bulk Capacity. New Ped Equipment: Tactical Equipment Harness: Provides pockets, holsters, and attachment points for equipment. The harness weighs 2 lbs and adds +5 to Base Bulk carry Capacity. Base Bulk items and items on a Tactical Harness are immediately available during Combat. Back Pack: Weighs 5 lbs and provides +20 bulk capacity. Disadvantage, adding or removing items from the Back Pack is a multiple turn long duration action like reloading. Armor adds some bulk because wearing armor constricts your movements somewhat. This is most easily represented as added bulk. Personal Armor: Non-ablative. Helmet: 3 lbs., 1 bulk. Absorbs 1 point of damage for head hits. Flak Jacket: 6 lbs., 1 bulk. Absorbs 1 point of damage for torso hits Body Armor: 12 lbs., 2 bulk. Absorbs 1 point of damage for a hit anywhere on the body except head (helmet is seperate). Medical Equipment: FA kit: 3 lbs., 1 bulk. Boosts the FA skill of the user by 30%. For example: A ganger with FA 50 would perform as if they were FA 65. Doctor's Bag: 9 lbs., 2 bulk. Boosts the FA skill of the user by 50%. Also includes drugs and anti-venom to treat radiation sickness, insect stings, etc, during Footsquad travel. Mechanic's toolboxes: Mechanic Kit: 12 lbs., 4 bulk. Improves mechanic skill roll for Jury Rigging and/or Salvaging. Lowers chance of damaging weapons while removing them. Allows a mechanic with Salvager Specialism to choose which weapons to pull from cars. (Lack a driver? Dismount weapons and carry as cargo for example.) Armor Kit: 12 lbs., 4 bulk. Adds some hammers, punches, and miscellaneous tools to the basic Mechanic Kit. Allows a mechanic to pull armor plate (scrap metal) off a junk loot car and field patch armor on a keeper. Add 3 points of armor (subject to max armor limits) to one side of a vehicle. Camping/survival equipment, food, water: Reduces radiation poisoning during Footsquad travel by providing safe water and food. Note: The seriousness of radiation poisoning should be increased. Current rules apparently assume gangers are carrying some supplies. Canteen: 4 lbs, 1 bulk. 1 day supply of water for 1 ganger. Prehaps add a dehydration damage for characters without adequate water? Survival Pack: 10 lbs., 2 bulk. Two days supply of food plus miscellaneous suvival items. Halves the amont of radiation poison picked up in the wilderness. Binoculors: 3 lbs, 1 bulk. Provide some small boost to scouting skill similar to how a medikit boosts FA. Artillary Spotter Binocs: 6 lbs, 2 bulk. These large and powerful binoculars give a much larger boost to scouting skill similar to how a Doctor's bag boosts FA. |
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*Longo* Posted May 14, 2009, 2:19 pm |
Swords Sam, Swords! | ||||||
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Iron Wraith Posted May 16, 2009, 8:05 am |
I like the idea of personal equipment boosting skills and I would expect the mechanics would be relatively simple to implement.
Those things that allow a whole new area of game play (like the portabale machnic shops that would allow you to repair armour etc) would be harder to implement and not as good a return on the time invested. If you think that the pirates that you were attacking might have freinds not too far away, do you really want to be making significant modifications to your vehicles. Peds could do with a LAW to really threaten cars 
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*Tinker* Posted May 16, 2009, 9:56 am |
did some one say moltov ####tails allready? | ||||||
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Jaguar Posted May 17, 2009, 6:50 pm |
It would be neat if the peds could use their equipment while in the car as well as on foot. Sure, throwing a grenade or molotov or tryig to shoot a rifle in a car is probably really inaccurate but might be better than some passengers not doing something. | ||||||
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putriddead Posted May 24, 2009, 3:43 pm |
CHAINSAWS!!! for those pesky trees, cacti and pirate skulls that always get in your way. |
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*Ayjona* Posted May 24, 2009, 4:05 pm |
Yes, this goes well in line with Darkwind's venerable predecessor... I think it all comes down to in-canon specifics and anal details: you don't wanna open the window of yer car in a firefight. So, there has to be a way to fire out of the car without exposing the interior. I actually discussed this with Rhalp the other day, in relation to Car Wars, and the possibility for extra character to fire their hand weapons out of the windows of the Car Wars vehicles. Many of the car models in Darkwind seem to have thick but perforated armour, with hundreds of little holes all over the windshield and side windows. Could a pedestrian conceivable fire out of those holes (provided there's no glass behind the armour), with some kind of reasonable accuracy? |
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Jaguar Posted May 24, 2009, 8:30 pm |
The more heavily armored cars also seem to have slits in the armor that serve the same purpose - vision slots. Early tank crews would communicate by releasing carrier pigeons their their vision lots. As far as DW is concerned, these could probably be used to stick the muzzle of a gun or force a small handheld grenade out. Some vehicles (probably the lighter ones) might have purpose built panels for this sort of thing. The buggy, conversely, might be exposed enough that it's a moot point.
Of course, in considering all this, it behooves me consider if having a ped interact with things outside the vehicle would really be worthwhile. I could see them doing internal things like making repairs, reloading, etc , but what advantages would it give for a ped to expose themselves and the vehicle? Certainly any weapon or system a ped could deploy could be duplicated on the car itself. An advantage might be a space saving - instead of installing a vehicular shotgun, a ped might simply stick the barrel of a shotgun out of a window (or whatever) and fire at a nearby vehicle or ped. Less effective perhaps but may be a more optimal solution in some cases. However, perhaps not useful enough to really turn it into a game system. Another situation would be the ped doing something that the car itself could not duplicate or do. Perhaps looking at a tank crew might offer some ideas. Tank crews (well, an M1 Abrams anyway though certainly there will be similarities across all modern tank crews) have a four man crew. A driver, a commander, a gunner, and a loader. We already incorporate the driver and gunner positions and the loader position is perhaps a little -too- specialized considering the somewhat more abstracted nature of DW. The commander position perhaps fits more with a different thread about peds doing things, though still applicable. One thought might be an exchange of goods or information with other nearby vehicles. Two cars parked next to each other - one has had it's ammo destroyed. The other might be allowed to exchange a load of ammo (if of the appropriate type). Another would be something like tossing out damaged components like burning ammo out the window; risking exposing some of the armor to getting rid of an explosive danger. |
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Marrkos Posted May 24, 2009, 11:09 pm |
I don't think you can actually base what the occupants can do on what the vehicle looks like in the game, unfortunately. The cars we see can be, as far as I know, skinned in virtually any manner imaginable. So, if somebody makes a skin that shows a big hole in the roof, it doesn't mean the model has a hole there available for characters to pop out of. There's a suggestion floating around that goes something like: If a vehicle has an unused weapon slot it can be used by the occupants for firing ped weapons. |
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Jaguar Posted May 25, 2009, 6:55 am |
Perhaps. Perhaps not. Tanks and other armored fighting vehicles have vision slots. And modern composite armor is actually somewhat full of holes (abit not visible) to improve on weight. Anyway, cosmetics are not really relevant.
Perhaps a better comparision would be Infantry Fighting Vehicles which are expressly intended for infantry to fire from inside them. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:BMP-1_firing_arcs.png That's the firing arcs from the world's first infantry fighting vehicle which was introduced in 1966. Judging by the pictures, these do indeed have panels (firing ports) that open and close to let infantry fire from them then retreat behind cover. Not to be confused with APCs. |
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*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted May 25, 2009, 10:07 am |
Well none of my Apachees have weapon slots as i use a skin, as stated by markoss the skins are just a representation of the vehicle, not a solid design, the ability to throw grenades and use small arms has come out on numerous occasions, i prefer my HMG and GG rather than a ped weapon, i like me cars
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*Ayjona* Posted May 25, 2009, 1:56 pm |
Right now, we're discussing peds firing out of vehicles from an in-canon perspective, which means that the webpage appearance of the vehicle is a determining factor. The cars can indeed be skinned to look like a bike with flower arrangements instead of armour, but these are the visual representations of each vehicle as imagined and visualized by Sam, and can therefore be assumed to be acute representations of what the cars actually look like in Evan (I received developer confirmation this is indeed the case, a long time ago). So, slots and perforated armour is exatly what these vehicular babies are packing, in-game, and that leaves room for possible (possible, mind you) pedestrian attacks from the interior of a car. From an in-canon perspective. The mechanical implementation is quite another matter. The suggestion you mentioned, though, is definitively a good one. It would be durned fun to throw a few extra rifle attacks out the left side of your car, even if they only scratch and annoy your enemies
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ISHOULDCOCO Posted May 25, 2009, 2:54 pm |
Talking of food -
I want to eat the roadkill 
Hand Flares and smike grenades (we have smoke in the game) great instant ignition for a breached car I donot feel that we ever address in game communication properly I think a ped should be able to stand beside a stationary car for 5 seconds and have a reasonable chance at internals ( likelyhood based on the amount of armour lost in the scout so far) A ped stationary beside a vehicle should get a right click option to shoot the tire too. Molotoves should have a reduced chance of fire on compared to Flamethrowers - there is so little fuel involved -an internal strike has more chance One shot dropped weapons and calatrops are all good Satchel Charges should do no more than a Medium Rocket and that wouldbe a biggie backpack load. Proper 'set shaped charges' are really nasty but require a lot longer duration - expert demoltions against a fixed object would be magnitudesmore effective. Spears are a great weapon too Limpet/magnetic mines would be feasiblebut probablyonlyfor rpg / special missions. Entrenching tool - a man under fire can make cover real fast - DW is a very barren game - I would allow a prone mode and a 'half-sunken' cover mode too for peds ( no movement , but half of model is submerged ) A simple modelof a bonfire/ camp emplacement wouldbe great too for raids. COCO |
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Joel Autobaun Posted Jun 4, 2009, 9:02 pm |
I think at some point - if Ped weapons are decided to be able to fire from cars (as a codeable "doable"), then vehicles need a "Buttoned" or "Unbuttoned" option. Takes a second to change from one to the other. If you are "Unbuttoned" you could take direct internals ala exposed engines, occupants can target front/back and the side they are sitting on, and fire. Each chassis having a different chance(Like the landy would have a low chance - a racoon would have a higher chance).
Mostly it would be helpful for finishing off stunned demo's and killing enemy peds(who should also be coded to shoot at cars imo), it MIGHT take away from weapons like the flechette and VS however. |
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Jaguar Posted Jun 5, 2009, 3:16 am |
Perhaps harpoons that stick into a target and connecting the target with the shooter (or with some other target). |
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*sam* Posted Jul 10, 2009, 8:41 pm |
From TKW Prime:
--------------- PML: Pedestrian Missle Launcher: 18 lbs, 4 bulk to carry. 5 shots. Reloads are 1 lb, 2 bulk each. Fires same micro-missle as the MML. Molotov ####tail: 2 lbs, 2 bulk. Thrown like a grenade. Creates a patch of flaming oil at point of impact. If it lands on a vehicle, the flaming oil sticks to the vehicle and does flame damage to the side that was hit until the flaming oil burns out. While not particularly damaging to armored vehicles, this weapon tends to freak out occupants by generating high stress levels. Can Opener: 12 lbs, 3 bulk to carry. A chainsaw modified with a metal cutting blade. Does 2 points per turn damage to vehicle armor or creatures. Short range only. Ped must be as close to target as a ped attempting to turn over a vehicle. Satchel Charge: 8 lbs, 2 bulk to carry. Can be thrown about half the range of a grenade (has a handle so you can wind up and do a hammer throw style throw.) Or can simply be dropped on the ground. Upon impact if thrown or after 3 turns if dropped, satchel charge detonates with force equal to a Heavy Rocket warhead. |
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Whiskey Posted Jul 10, 2009, 8:50 pm |
Thanks Sam. I should have remembered this thread instead of starting a new one. | ||||||
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Serephe Posted Jul 10, 2009, 8:54 pm |
Satchel charges? Oh yes! | ||||||
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Procyon Posted Jul 16, 2009, 7:24 pm |
Antivenom kit:
1 Bulk. If present in a footsquad, greatly reduces chances of death from being poisoned. Perhaps "greatly" is affected by best medic skill in squad. |
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Jaguar Posted Jul 16, 2009, 7:59 pm |
With all the weapons, I didn't see any suggestions on like... a med kit, bandages, and what have you. Or fire fighting equipment.
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Whiskey Posted Jul 16, 2009, 8:31 pm |
First page of the thread, 4th post from the bottom. |
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Jaguar Posted Jul 17, 2009, 12:25 am |
Bares repeating then.
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Groove Champion Posted Jul 17, 2009, 1:14 am |
What about some serious melee weapons like chainsaws and welding torches? Could be fun if these weapons did very heavy damage (based on strenght and dexterity?)... seems to me like it makes up for the added risk of getting personal with the nasties. | ||||||
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tecnoscythe Joshua_Poggi@Yahoo.com Posted Jul 29, 2009, 9:38 pm |
how about RPGS mountable machine guns and other such or melee weapons such as knifes,swords,and bayonets on weapons | ||||||
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Jaguar Posted Jul 29, 2009, 10:03 pm |
I don't see a chainsaw being a particularly useful melee weapon. Dangerous yeah, but unwieldy and tiring. |
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Groovelle Posted Aug 2, 2009, 4:53 am |
Fire Extinguiser. Being able to both get out and use it on other cars and use it in the car the character is riding in would rock. Characters would have to give up the wheel for a time if they're driving and need to put a fire out. | ||||||
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ISHOULDCOCO Posted Aug 7, 2009, 7:11 am |
maybe it is already here
but...................... Fuel drums 10 bulk - as usual Fuel Cans 3 Bulk - AND man portable You can of course collect your fuel in your helmet or a beercan, if it is that rare. This would solve many probs and has a better feel than ultra-fast bespoke retro fitting of tanks COCO |
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tecnoscythe Joshua_Poggi@Yahoo.com Posted Aug 17, 2009, 5:51 pm |
Also the introduction of scopes that you can add to a rifle or maybe even a shot gun =] | ||||||
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FireFly Posted Sep 21, 2009, 3:27 pm |
Give me P90, Rapid fire weapon of doom!
Otherwise, the FN Minimi Para will substitute perfectly! Those things will make peds... MEAN 
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ISHOULDCOCO Posted Sep 22, 2009, 3:01 pm |
No to scopes, Yes to sniper rifles
Fire from prone only , fire every other round ( bolt action ) 1.5 x rifle damage , 1.5 x rifle range modifiers This weapon is a bit of a liability in vehicle combat theatre , but in right hands can be a deal-closer. COCO |
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Fealty Lost Posted Sep 22, 2009, 4:30 pm |
I like idea of fire extinguishers in cars...having had more than a few go ka-blooie along with lost vet' gangers ONE turn after catching fire.
But there should be option of 'hand-held' extinguisher (5 seconds to use); 1 bulk, 5 weight; or a car-mounted extinguisher system: 10 bulk, 50 weight, 5 shots. Can be reloaded after combat just like regular weapons. Like idea of sniper rifles...especially for arena combat/races. Without backup in wilderness, would probably be bug-bait. |
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*goat starer* Posted Sep 22, 2009, 4:39 pm |
PLEASE can we have this... a couple of days ago one of my famous buzzers containing my best scout and gang leader caught fire after a tiny collision with a very small dead tree..... i nearly died with the tension waiting for it to go out..... let us fight fire! |
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betterlucky Posted Sep 23, 2009, 6:17 pm |
If we're having gang members being captured now, how about some incapacitating weaons? Stickum guns, quick hardening foam or even stun gas perhaps.
Obviously only effective against breached cars and I'd even suggest that they should be either ped only or work much better as ped versions (though it's hard to get the idea of a stun gas grenade launcher out of my head ). Effects would wear off, so you'd have to reapply if the fight goes much longer. But it would mean capturing more gangers alive and unmaimed than with the current soft target weapons.
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*goat starer* Posted Sep 27, 2009, 11:27 am |
nuff said! |
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WolfEater Posted Oct 1, 2009, 3:33 pm |
Ped Gear:
Camouflage Paint Kit: I don't know how much IBS it is but it wait 0.1 KG's. it include a little mirror and 4-6 different paint's Black White Dark Green, Light Green. its a lil box that opens very use full in combat. Camouflage Out Fit: including pants and a shirt the covers the hole body from head to toe + for the weapon. Used officially by sniper's and in Behind enemy lines. Can be used with Body armor and Head gear. makes the Ped almost invisible while not moving. if ped use Body armor and other stuff his speed reaction should be reduced so in each turn he shot slower(last) 15-25% in speed redaction. and Weight also project on the ped speed. Back pack and all that Gear slow down. |
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WolfEater Posted Oct 5, 2009, 9:41 pm |
Ped Mounted Weapon's:
Portable car Grenade Launcher the same Car grange launcher we got for cars only portable XM307 it can be deployed from a car with 2 or 3 ped's depend on the Portable weapon. it can be HMG HGG Rocket launcher. ATG and CC are too big and heavy to carry but can be deployed as an Stationed defense camp or town defense. the deployed weapon got a certain degree he can shot and in order to change it, it need to be picked up. the degree is 90 and 15 down and 35 up. the accuracy of stationed is larger then when it mounted on a car. I don't know much but maybe this stationed/portable weapon can be used as a car in game with the panel and all Sniper Rifle: I thinking of 2 Snipers 1 against Ped and 1 against cars like M24 and M82 or the M107 that are the same but different models |
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*sam* Posted Dec 6, 2009, 11:35 pm |
Low-tech body armour such as helmets, breastplates or chainmail shirts | ||||||
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*goat starer* Posted Dec 7, 2009, 12:55 am |
sam... are you suggesting things that have been suggested millions of times before... for you to implement? i am confused! 
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Lord Foul Posted Dec 7, 2009, 1:08 am |
Yeah Goat, that is rather odd.
Lik I mentioned in the other thread: This idea keeps coming up from time to time, but evetually gets shot down due to few reasons.. Characters in general can take far more punishment than equipment and it is already considered that characters would salvage anything they can find to use as protection. High strength characters can take many hits before they finally expire(unless a headshot). Many weapons on the other hand can be totally destroyed with one hit and can't take more than 2 hits before being at 0% 9 out of 10 times. Adding armor of any kind would create an even further gap in what damage a character can take compared to what most objects around them can take. Some human characters can be hit up to ten times before they die, like going through 10 points of chassis armor. Add in mutants with 140-160 strength and we can see how silly things can get when trying to kill a ped compared to other items. |
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Zephyr Posted Dec 27, 2009, 8:41 am |
Here's my idea:
Duct Tape The mechanic's best friend, it can be used to effect temporary repairs in the field. It has come to be a rare and highly treasured piece of loot. How it works: If a vehicle has a damaged component, and a character has a roll of Duct Tape, that character can use their Mechanic skill to temporarily repair a damaged item on the car. Not much, say; a value of between 0% - 30% "healing" to the component based on the character's Mechanic skill and random chance. If in vehicle: open "occupants," right-click on the character's icon, and in the pop-up menu it will list the things you can repair with the roll of duct tape. Select the item. It will take a length of time comparable to reloading ammo. If a ped: ped must be in contact with vehicle; right-click on vehicle, and the pop-up menu will list the items the ped can attempt to use the duct tape on. Takes an amount of time comparable to reloading ammo, and vehicle and ped must be in contact the entire time. If succesful, the targeted system is patched up a bit; this is a temporary repair only and goes away at the end of the encounter. The roll of duct tape is used up, whether or not the attempt was successful. |
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Flaming savage Posted Jan 10, 2010, 8:38 pm |
Grapiling hooks;can be thrown onto anything that had a ledge or pices sticking out. It would have like a 1 in 3 chance of catching and the stronger the ped the faster is gets up the rope. | ||||||
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*sam* Posted Jan 10, 2010, 9:25 pm |
You mean you haven't realised that my memory resembles a sieve? Choice anecdote: I started telling my wife a story about something or other that happened when I was a kid. Then I stopped. "Oh wait.. or was that a story you already told me about when you were a kid?" |
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Groove Champion Posted Jan 11, 2010, 2:42 pm |
I like the duct tape idea! I've seen it applied in Nascar many times and I find the idea of poorly patched up wrecks driving around Evan quite entertaining. | ||||||
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Rick #Red# Ryder Posted Jan 15, 2010, 11:53 am |
I came to the forum to suggest some ped gear to offer some slight survivability increase, but it seems well in hand.
One thing I didn't see here was a fire retardant suit. Just stops/reduces that bonus concussion damage from being on fire, that's it. No weight/bulk just pricey, or maybe a drop. Make it seperate from the armor, more goodies to dangle off of your guy. Do a racing suit (this is what the web stores call them, I bet some more eloquent poster could think up a sexier name if neccessary) and a duelling suit (thus the "body armor" and "improved body armor"). Have them reduce the injury roll slightly or something. If you're feeling ambitious perhaps you could do a second injury table for characters with body armor on. That could capture the feel of body armor doing something without screwing up the mechanic too terribly. ("So and so has a near death experience as a huge chunk of shrapnel lodges in the faceplate of thier helmet" as a typical minor head injury roll or something) One option that may give good bang for the buck is to do one or two types but with several different names to suit different player flavors. (e.g. racing suit = spiked leather jacket = mutant bugshell chitin = chainmail etc)... Just more ped jewelry, it doesn't have to actually *do* much, if anything, does it? Oh and a few racing suit textures for the little avatar guys would be cool too. 
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Zephyr Posted Jan 20, 2010, 11:42 pm |
I don't think I've seen anyone list other types of hand grenades for peds listed:
-Paint grenades -Smoke grenades -Incendiary Grenade (Creates an item like a Flaming Oil Jet puddle) or maybe these could be the Molotov ####tails -Anti-tank grenades |
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Groove Champion Posted Jan 21, 2010, 2:21 am |
Sun screen Radiation Suit:
Protects a character from radiation poisoning when walking home. This would allow players to trade a vehicular passenger for bulk space when looting without suffering the huge health penalty associated to strolling in the desert unprotected. This would also be an interesting item for players wishing to "guarantee" their characters' safety when scouting down South where the chances of a vehicle returning home after a scout are considerably lessened. |
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*Longo* Posted Jan 21, 2010, 2:24 am |
bulk amount? |
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Groove Champion Posted Jan 21, 2010, 2:34 am |
I have no idea... The bulk should be enough that it should force players to trade offensive power for defensive strenght, but not so much that it turns pedestrians into walking lunches for those nasty Evanian critters
Without considering the issue longly, I suggest the bulk should be low enough to allow a pedestrian to carry a rifle, but too high for him to carry reloads? I think this would work because a player could then choose to outfit a valuable character with a radiation suit while leaving a few less valued escorts to fry in the heat while they carry more serious firepower. |
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*Bastille* Posted Jan 22, 2010, 9:09 am |
2 shot mini/light rocket launcher. Works like a normal ped weapon. And ped FTs. | ||||||
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Zephyr Posted Jan 22, 2010, 8:48 pm |
I'm beginning to imagine a new big patch for Darkwind sometime in the near future, called "Ped's Revenge." With all sorts of new Ped equipment, including body armor, man-portable AT weapons, and accessories. Let's hope Sam has time to work on these kinds of things. Ped FTs would be just way too much fun.
When's the next paintball league? I gotta start training up my Mechanized Infantry platoon. |
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triad4evr Posted Jan 30, 2010, 2:13 am |
Since this is stickied, but hasn't seen much action, and since I've still not been able to find a function to search for what I'm looking for, how about being able to loot peds and ped equipment. That would make me happy when all I have is shotguns and the enemy characters are running around with rifles! | ||||||
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Nekojin Posted Jan 30, 2010, 2:30 am |
Ped-deployable spike strips. Like spikedroppers, but longer. | ||||||
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Kornkob The Dude Posted Feb 1, 2010, 2:38 pm |
Crew Served Weapon Mount: 3 bulk
Similar to the US Army's M3 weapon mount, this mount can be added to any vehicular weapon to allow 2 peds to carry,deploy and fire the attached weapon. Adds 3 bulk to the weapon for purposes of transport in vehicle. Takes 5 seconds to deploy or pick up weapon. PEDs cannot engage in any other activity while a member of a crew served weapon team. |
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Knight Posted Feb 3, 2010, 5:33 pm |
Definately crew served weapons as mentioned before
Anti-tank rifles (perfect against light skinned vehicles present in DW, very little armor damage, but with a chance of internal damage from the round ricocheting around. Ped is prone and can't move while deployed) Wire guided missiles Tripod Mounted HMGs Crew served weapons would take up vehicle bulk for stowage (but less than car mounted weapons) as a tradeoff between vehicle weapons and ped weapons. Make it so that dumping troops from IFVs is a legitimate strategy. |
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Zephyr Posted Feb 11, 2010, 4:33 am |
I was reading the "pistols are not useless" thread, and I had an idea how to make pistols more appealing, and not just by increasing their magazine size.
How about having pistols give the wielder a SPD bonus? Perhaps make it the equivalent of one level of the "Quickdraw" handguns spec. |
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Procyon Posted Feb 11, 2010, 8:21 am |
Speed bonus for pistols would be very cool. | ||||||
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EnglishRanger Posted Feb 23, 2010, 5:12 pm |
Some more ideas:
Compass, possibly GPS if the satellites are still functioning. These could help the scouts lead gangs back to town. Maps, accurate ones would be rare and let people return quickly, bad ones will lead people off cliffs and into quicksand. Camouflage clothing, to hide with. Ghillie suits for those with money, more advanced thermal blankets could be used to hide from those with thermal imaging devices. Water purification equipment, from iodine tablets to pumps, the better the kit the less sick gangers get. |
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*sam* Posted Feb 23, 2010, 5:14 pm |
Excellent idea, and eminently implementable. Will add this at next patch. |
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EnglishRanger Posted Feb 23, 2010, 5:29 pm |
In our vehicle at work we have a few carefully placed thermite grenades in our vehicles, if we need to abandon it then the pins are pulled by the last guy out. In game this would stop NPCs or other players getting your vehicles.
There is the automatic fire extinguisher that is supposed to kick in when the vehicle starts to burn. It wouldn't be enough to put out the above mentioned termite grenades but could be of use. Incidentally when your driver accidently activates the system while doing 40mph and the vehicle is suddenly filled with inert gas it isn't quite as funny as you'd imagine... Speaking of all the infantry fighting vehicles where can I get a vehicle with tracks instead of tires? Melee weapons are probably useless in ped combat. Unless you are in buildings the range at which you make contact with the enemy is too large for them to be useful. Gangers carrying a variety of rifles is probably the most realistic. In Afghanistan (terrain similar in many respects to Evan) the locals had great success against the Russians as their old bolt action Lee Enfield rifles had more than double the effective range of the Russian Ak-47. Of course if you add in the cool factor the Russians still win. |
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*goat starer* Posted Feb 23, 2010, 5:59 pm |
ewwwwww! termite grenades! disgusting |
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EnglishRanger Posted Feb 23, 2010, 6:07 pm |
oops, i let it out about the super-secret termite grenades. Very similar in appearance to your usual thermite but when it is set off instead of intense heat, it throws out a mass of termites. These were used in the old west to destroy horse drawn carriages if the indians were about to capture them. Apparently two termite grenades could eat an average stagecoach in under 5 minutes. With the advent of metal vehicles these grenades have fallen out of favor but are still to be found occasionally. Drive-by shootings using donkey carts can still be prevented with these useful munitions... |
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Zephyr Posted Feb 24, 2010, 5:22 am |
Now I know what to arm myself with when the Amish Revolution comes.
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JS Posted Mar 2, 2010, 11:32 am |
Tried to find if this was in here, sorry if its been covered.
Fire Extinguisher. Small hand carried one could have a chance to put out a fire, maybe have the interfacr on the manage tab like PSI abilities. Also, would be cool to have larger vehicle systems that cost bulk for the car but are more effective. Perhaps charges, or just one activation |
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Armisius Posted May 18, 2010, 12:55 am |
I didn't see this listed before, so I hope it is an original idea. . .
Steel toed boots. I don't know how many of my poor gangers get their toes blown off.
Part of my "Save the Toes" Campaign. |
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PA Racers Posted Jun 30, 2010, 12:38 pm |
I like the being able to loot hand weapons idea!!! | ||||||
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Groove Champion Posted Jun 30, 2010, 1:05 pm |
At the very least (if they can't be looted for some reason) rifles and SMGs should become hero point staple items: if nothing else is available, these are. | ||||||
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Ballistix Posted Jul 7, 2010, 3:27 am |
Just to add to the list as I didnt see this thread before I posted another....
Fire Extinguisher. Ped weapon can be used after exiting a burning vehicle. |
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Oscoda Posted Jul 25, 2010, 1:37 am |
*every* car should have a fire extinguisher by default. They are small and don't have to count against the bulk in the car. I just lost a ganger in an arena combat because an HMG breached my still intact armor and started my engine on fire. I got out, got gunned down and sat unconscious ten feet from from the car when it *did* explode.  So from a single HMG hit, my option was to wait inside for the car to explode, or sit beside it unconscious and die in the explosion anyway.
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*Bastille* Posted Jul 25, 2010, 2:58 am |
I thought some kind of fire extinguisher skill came into effect when the fire rules changed, is this true? (I'll do a search and post anything I find here)
More of this would be good I think. Everyone has a hand gun, pretty sure there would be ample of these lying around after a fight. |
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*Tinker* Posted Jul 25, 2010, 3:04 am |
From what i understand, the way it is now, every gangster in the car helps extinguish fires, the more peds the better chance of putting it out, because they are swatting at the flames with their jackets one handed or something. | ||||||
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Oscoda Posted Jul 25, 2010, 12:55 pm |
Yeah, apparently I haven't been catching all the patch notes. maybe something to the effect of " 'insert name here' is trying to put out the fire!" might be good to have. | ||||||
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*Maxxed* Posted Aug 7, 2010, 3:55 pm |
Rat bait - dropper for peds that would be treated by NPC bugs as a valid target and causes damage to bug when 'consumed'
Also bear/man-traps would be cool. ...and grenades. |
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*Maxxed* Posted Aug 7, 2010, 3:57 pm |
I think fire-extinguishers are a cool idea but should take up a small amount of bulk (1-3perhaps) | ||||||
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*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Aug 7, 2010, 4:36 pm |
we have grenade belts | ||||||
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*Maxxed* Posted Aug 8, 2010, 12:26 am |
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*Maxxed* Posted Aug 8, 2010, 12:27 am |
swapping of equipment between peds and vehicles mid combat |
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*Maxxed* Posted Aug 8, 2010, 12:40 am |
strobe lights, flare guns, lasers that damage eyes, super targeting scopes, flash npc loot gear, cybernetics and bio-gear, mutant faceplates and tentacled avatars :Z
Gold as the missing commodity... |
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*Rev. V* Posted Aug 23, 2010, 4:03 pm |
"I don't see a chainsaw being a particularly useful melee weapon"
Ah, but you are forgetting one very important point- The intimidation effect of someone with death in their eyes and a handful of whirling steel blade.... I mean, seriously, who WANTS to get near an angry person wielding a chainsaw? NO ONE!
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Zephyr Posted Sep 3, 2010, 6:51 pm |
Dual-wielding hand weapons. Like Grogat's avatar, or like Chow Yun-Fat in any John Woo movie | ||||||
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Snidely Carmichael Posted Sep 4, 2010, 11:48 am |
I'm curious why there are no heavy ped weapons such as an RPG launcher or (going back to Car Wars) LAW/VLAW. Have they been ruled out as a balance issue?
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Stucky Posted Sep 12, 2010, 12:42 pm |
Fire extinguishers.
Gun ports so my Handgunners can plink away (at a penalty to hit Im sure) while they're in the car. Fire extinguishers. I was going to ask for grenade launchers as a ped weapon, but yesterday I discovered that thats what mutants with 150 Str are for =] But most of all, Fire extinguishers. |
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Zephyr Posted Sep 14, 2010, 11:03 pm |
I'd suggest a revamp of pedestrian weapons. In terms of balance, I'm imagining a 3x3 matrix, like so:
Other balance issues would be handled in terms of weapon bulk, mag size, rarity and cost, et cetera. What do you think? |
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Crazy AL Posted Sep 15, 2010, 3:59 am |
cool | ||||||
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ISHOULDCOCO Posted Sep 15, 2010, 4:20 am |
I don't think there is a need, very much, at the moment. None of the weaps are actually broken. Helmets and Body armour are more relevant, IMHO. COCO |
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*Wolfsbane* Posted Sep 15, 2010, 6:59 am |
They're not broken, but there's not a lot of reason to use anything except the rifle. More (relevant) decisions is usually good. | ||||||
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FireFly Posted Sep 15, 2010, 8:28 am |
I'd say weapon balance is broken when there is only 1 weapon that's good to use, easy to obtain, and the weapon of choice.
The only thing that even rivals the rifle is the SMG, but that's only for very close range, the rest of the weapons are utter crap in comparison to them, and that's not balance, not by a longshot. |
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*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Sep 15, 2010, 10:26 am |
+1 on that |
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johnny go Posted Sep 15, 2010, 10:27 am |
i think another way to categorise the weapons is soft v hard targets, do you want to shoot up cars/gigent armore plated bugs or peds/beastlys?
weapons loaded whit different amo might also help, AP rifel or holow point? makes a big deliverance to how they perform on what. thair needs to be a tactical game balance to ped weapon chose , not just rifle is best. |
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ISHOULDCOCO Posted Sep 15, 2010, 10:42 am |
Cool , then its broken in your view.
But one weapon system will always beat another . For that matter the vehicle weapon system is broken too , cause everyone wants HCRs............ The reason all soldiers all carry rifles is because they are rifle, the heavy weapons guys carry a PDW or pistol. Folks use different weapons for different roles. A ped can carry a rifle , a SMG and a paint rifle simultaneously. I am sure SAM will do LAWs and VLAWS at some point But no one ( i know) has any expectation that all weapon systems should be balanced to an extent beyond practicality. Peds weapons are not that critical anyway , they are persoanl defense weapons , not game winners. I n a situation where they are game winners , everyone is going to go for the best possible kit anyway. Some thing has to be best, the rifle was in CW . I can live the current situation COCO |
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johnny go Posted Sep 15, 2010, 10:48 am |
indeed i don't think its a big issue, but if the ped scouting the ruins gose live it would be nice to have a few more tactical choses.
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Zephyr Posted Sep 15, 2010, 6:56 pm |
Right, that's my point here. The "Tyrrany of the Rifle" should be broken, if for no other reason as to make the game more interesting. (I'm operating under the assumption that variety = interesting.) In this model I propose, the rifle is the best all-around weapon, a great balance of range, damage, magazine size, bulk, and availability. So in that sense it is still "best." But other weapons are valid in specific circumatances. For example, when competing in close-combat such as the Gateway Pedestrian Combat Arena, shotguns and SMGs might be a better choice. Other factors that can make other weapons more useful: (a) weapon speed. Make the ped weapon you use play a factor in shooting order. So someone with a SMG can get off a burst before the guy with the hunting rifle is able to point, aim, and shoot. I think Sam mentioned he wanted to do something like this with pistols, to make them more useful. (b) make bulk a sliding scale. The current model for bulk is that each ped has a certain capacity and they can only carry what's in that capacity, but what they carry has no effect on their speed. Someone with 50 speed and a pistol moves just as fast as someone with 50 speed and a pistol, flamer, and grenade belt. My idea is to have a more sophisticated model. Allow peds to carry as much as they want, up to something like say 20 bulk, but every point of bulk they carry will impose a penalty on their Speed and Dex. A high Strength will reduce that penalty, so strong characters can carry more, but there will still be a penalty. So now the dude with the pistol is sprinting around while the guy with the flamer and grenade belt is waddling at one mile per hour. Basically imagine each ped as a mini-car, with "bulk" instead of vehicle weight and "strength" instead of "engine." This will be very inportant if/when body armor is added to the game, as there will need to be a reason not to turn your peds into mini tanks. (c) There are other "special traits" you can give ped weapons to make them more interesting, that can be borrowed from vehicle weapons. For example, have SMGs fire twice with each pull of the trigger, like mini-gats. Or have shotguns have more of an intimidation factor when someone is shot at with them, like flamers. And yes, I know anything pertaining to peds is minor and perhipheral to this game. But it's fun to discuss, IMHO. |
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Zephyr Posted Sep 15, 2010, 11:43 pm |
Maybe for the "ultimate" man-carried weapon, we could have man-portable prototype laser rifles. That could fill the "High Damage / Long Range" category nicely. And they would cost $1 Million each.
Perhaps they could look something like the laser rifles from Akira: 
Hey, it's just suggestion.... |
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*JD_Basher* jd.basher@charter.net Posted Sep 16, 2010, 1:22 am |
This IS a post-apocalyptic society based on our current tech level.
Are you sure "Pulse-Laser" Rifles are consistent with this drama? I'm pretty sure THAT type of Japanese Anime came out a few years after Sam published and loaded THIS game, BTW.
JD 
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*Rev. V* Posted Sep 30, 2010, 6:41 pm |
I'd be happy with a chainsaw attachment for rifle/shotgun.
Aw, hell, I'll be honest and admit it, I just want a CHAINSAW! |
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Bandulu Posted Oct 3, 2010, 11:03 pm |
I don't know whether Sam is still working on this idea or not, but I'll give my 2 cents anyway.
While a full inventory system for gangers would be nice, maybe to keep it simple, just add something like two or three slots for each ganger that they could use to carry gear. This way not only would it be easier to implement for Sam and to manage when you have a large gang but it would also force people to make difficult decisions like do I give this ganger anti radiation pills in case he gets to walk home, a pair of binoculars that gives a small bonus to scouting or a fire extinguisher? Also most of this stuff should be fairly rare I suppose and only give minor bonuses the way I see it for game balance. |
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*sam* Posted Nov 3, 2010, 1:18 pm |
Yep, I'm still working on this stuff!
This thread is here to gather ideas in one place until such time as I get around to working on it. Considering some of these right now.. |
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*Tinker* Posted Nov 3, 2010, 1:29 pm |
+1 on all points |
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theHumungous Posted Nov 3, 2010, 3:35 pm |
Yep. I'm also all for making the "other" ped weapons valid.
Pistols firing first - great at short range and can be fired in the same turn as they are aimed (and not using the speed bonus in that case). smgs firing twice but not terribly accurate at range, shotguns having great damage but fairly short range (if using shot - if it represents slug, then more range), rifles being what they are now... long range hunting class rifles, maybe with a smaller clip. Oh, and pistols should be able to have a few more clips. |
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*Rev. V* Posted Nov 3, 2010, 3:38 pm |
"Pistols firing first - great at short range and can be fired in the same turn as they are aimed"
Hmmm....maybe that would make a neat "Gunslinger" Handgun spec.... |
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Djihani Posted Nov 3, 2010, 5:30 pm |
Did anyone suggest ped armor and equipment affecting their in-car-bulk? No armor and pistol = squeeze him into a smaller slot - body armor and armed to the teeth = takes more place in a car.
Would make you decide whether you value ped survival or vehicles (also preventive survival). Would also ultimately allow for more vehicle variation! |
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*Tinker* Posted Nov 3, 2010, 6:32 pm |
sure would, but they aren't wearing full plate mail! |
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*Rev. V* Posted Nov 3, 2010, 7:19 pm |
And even if they were, it's nowhere NEAR as heavy and bulky as Hollywood would have you believe.... | ||||||
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Zephyr Posted Nov 3, 2010, 7:21 pm |
"He's gonna man the roof cupola heavy gat. Go get a crane so we can lift him up there." 
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Dreamthief Posted Nov 3, 2010, 8:32 pm |
Not sure if anyone's mentioned it already, but....
Jetpacks!! Probably very difficult to do and probably very silly. Still...would be cool
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JS Posted Nov 3, 2010, 8:54 pm |
With Ped bouncing physics, so they can bounce off walls, and get blasted out of the sky. |
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Juris Posted Dec 23, 2010, 1:00 am |
Cybernetic replacement parts (for peds). Would need to be rare and expensive. Also suggest they should only be available at a facility in Morgan to give the new town character. It'd be cool if Morgan was a center of science a technology (maybe that's where lasers are from). | ||||||
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*Rev. V* Posted Jan 6, 2011, 3:49 pm |
Chainsaws....
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Triferus Posted Jan 15, 2011, 7:23 am |
Other than adding new new weapons and equipment, what about making the existing weapons somewhat more like their real life counterparts?
Pistol - The description says this is a revolver. If so, it would probably be a .357 Magnum. Thus, it would have 7 shots, not 8, and possibly do slightly more damage. Also if it's a revolver I suggest changing the name of the weapon to "Revolver". Otherwise, if you make it a semi-automatic, then it would likely be a 9mm or a .40 Caliber with maybe 12 rounds. Either way, it wouldn't have 8 rounds... (I'll note that there *are* 8-round .357 Magnums in existence, but they're extremely rare and they don't have Speed Loaders like the 7-round and 6-round revolvers do.) You could also have both a Revolver and a Pistol (Semi-Auto) if you wanted. The current Pistol text arguing against a semi-auto mechanism doesn't really fly when there's an SMG. lol Shotgun - Shotguns with extended magazines can carry 8 rounds, not 10. Of course, you normally carry individual shells for shotguns, not magazines, with only a couple of exceptions. Should either do damage in a cone or fire 8 pellets (based on 00 Buckshot) per shot that each travel in a random direction within a cone shape. SMG - The most common magazine size for SMGs is 30 rounds. Small ones carry 20, and the largest can carry 50. The most realistic would be to have this weapon fire 3-round bursts. However, since the Gatling Gun fires 2-round bursts, the SMG could use 2-round bursts as well for this game. I see someone else suggested 2-round bursts for the SMG as well. Individual Rounds - Another idea is to change the ammo system to individual rounds, with X rounds per unit of bulk (probably equal to 1 Bulk divided by the number of rounds in a full load). That would: A) Prevent you from having to throw leftover rounds away when you reload. B) Make the Revolver and Shotgun more realistic. C) Allow you to scavenge a few rounds here and there. |
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Triferus Posted Jan 15, 2011, 7:28 am |
Is the current Rifle supposed to be a Hunting Rifle or a military Rifle (since the game has no Assault Rifle)? If it's definitely supposed to be a Hunting Rifle then I can agree, but if it's supposed to include any and all rifles then I can't.
I think you forgot that items already have weight in addition to bulk. The bulk isn't what should slow a Ped down, but rather the weight. |
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*Longo* Posted Jan 15, 2011, 7:57 am |
Most revolvers are 6 rounds, although they do make 7 round ones. The majority of shotguns hold 5, 4 in the tubular magazine, and 1 chambered round. |
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Triferus Posted Jan 15, 2011, 1:18 pm |
True on the first. On the second you'll note I said "with a magazine extension" which are extremely common in the U.S. You just unscrew the magazine cap on the end of the tube and screw on the extension. |
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Burntoast Posted Mar 4, 2011, 8:15 pm |
Last night during a scout my son suggested an RPG would have been nice. I see it has been suggested before.
Based on the tech level there is no reason not to have them in game. Take a rocket and stick it in a tube, or manufacure them in camp. This should be a very bulky weapon that shoots a light rocket. I would suggest a 3 round magazine. It should be a 5 bulk weapon. Reloads should be 3 bulk and reloadable only from cargo between rounds - or perhaps reloadable if you reenter the car. Balance: I would ban them from town pedestrian/gladiator combats. (I don't know how projectiles are handled but..) They should be inaccurate against pedestrians. They should be able to hit a vehicle because of a cars large size. Now load up your bus with 25 peds with RPGs and get out there looking for pirates. |
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*Rev. V* Posted Mar 4, 2011, 8:17 pm |
How about a RPC?
Rocket Propelled Chainsaw.....
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JS Posted Mar 4, 2011, 8:54 pm |
+69 |
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ninjamonkey73 Posted Mar 5, 2011, 8:00 am |
Basically, every Car Wars item that isn't in the game yet.
Body Armor (absorbs X hits, ablative) Makes peds less squishy, which in turn makes them more threatening. Potentially increases character lifespan. Flak Jacket (66.66% chance of absorbing X hits, ablative) Cheaper than Body Armor, and less bulky. Also, probably a lot more common. Improved Body Armor (absorbs 2X hits, ablative) Expensive, bulky and not at all common. On the plus side, it's somewhat effective against Fire damage. Portable Fire Extinguisher (33.33% chance of working) I don't need to tell you how useful this would be in a vehicle. Tripod-Mounted MG (must be set up before use; firer cannot move; otherwise equivalent to vehicular MG) This would enable Peds to lay down weapons fire from a strategic position; could be incorporated into Ped Wilderness Encounters (meaning that your Scouting Squad may be ambushed by Peds.) LAW and VLAW (single shot only; equal to LR and MR respectively) No more pecking away with Rifles and Shotguns... Peds would have the ability to inflict more significant damage AND create uncomfortable physics! Grenades not attached to belts, and of various types such as Smoke, Paint, etc. Peds could then be used in support roles, the way a DaVinci supports NPC gangs. Also... Mines In the real world, these are not dispensed by machine. People place them. |
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Jant Posted Mar 17, 2011, 7:11 pm |
Shields of different types, from a wheel cover to a rare riot shield, shields would be of different szie, weight and affectiveness.
Anti Poison Kit - so that if one of your guys gets bitten, there is a chance the npc could be saved if someone has the kit on them. |
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Kornkob The Dude Posted Mar 17, 2011, 8:13 pm |
Ahem. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Minenwerfer_Skorpion_04.JPG |
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Juris Posted Mar 17, 2011, 8:36 pm |
+1 - Just not bricks of plastique, that was broken. Definitely grenade launchers
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Magus Posted Apr 27, 2011, 7:06 pm |
I think anything that will make a ped be of more use in a combat inside or outside the vehicle besides driving and pulling the trigger of a car gun would be awesome...and would put a brand new and exciting twist on the game...
"Better go run down that ped" ...oh snap RPG to my car |
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*goat starer* Posted Apr 27, 2011, 9:43 pm |
or indeed http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JP233 |
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Cadimus Posted May 3, 2011, 5:19 pm |
What about including ped weapons during the loot phase at the end of a scout? | ||||||
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Groove Champion Posted May 3, 2011, 5:21 pm |
I vaguely remember Sam saying the equipment carried by peds isn't part of the same data "group" as the vehicle components and vehicles we loot after scouts, and that is why they aren't included.
I guess a few could be generated at random on occasion? |
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*Rev. V* Posted May 3, 2011, 5:39 pm |
I dunno...we can loot hand flamers...that's a ped weapon.
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Groove Champion Posted May 3, 2011, 5:43 pm |
From traders? Could be cargo... | ||||||
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*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted May 3, 2011, 5:56 pm |
This has been asked for many times...the loot phase is a nightmare bit of code, hence why this never gets implemented |
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*Bastille* Posted May 3, 2011, 9:54 pm |
would it be possible to give away hps for handguns only, in the local shops? | ||||||
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted Jun 5, 2011, 4:56 pm |
Fire extinguishers.
Red ones, mebbe. The kind that may or may not put out a small car fire, but at least give you a shot. Extinguishers of flame. Hand-held. Bulky, heavy, but oh so very valuable. Of course you'd have to exit the vehicle to put out an engine fire. But if you had a fire extinguisher you could get out and feel like you were doing something besides getting your arms and legs blown off. Yep. I suggest fire extinguishers. I suggest them many times over. They have probably been suggested before, and I wish to suggest them again. Fire extinguishers. Red ones. The kind that extinguish fires. For pedestrians. Not for flaming pedestrians, I mean for flaming cars, but carried by pedestrians.
((offered in memory of Josie 'Blackheart' Wales, who died running away from a fire she would rather have fought)) |
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted Jun 6, 2011, 2:05 am |
Good idea, me. The problem is it's already been debated and you're not only beating a dead horse, you're beating a dead horse that's decomposed so completely that you can't even find it to beat it anymore. Seems our characters are already doing what they can to fight vehicle fires (from inside the car, apparently). And beyond that, fire is supposed to be scary, so if it's easily handled then one of the great adrenaline-pumps of the game is mitigated, and that's no fun for anyone.
Well yeah, me, I see all that. But I'm not suggesting this be EASY. I'd just like to be able to take an active role in this. See, an engine fire can't really be addressed from the passenger compartment. So I'm proposing that in order to actually USE this extinguisher, I would have to: 1. Stop the car, 2. Exit the vehicle, 3. Dodge whatever bullets, shrapnel, and other vehicles may be out there, 4. Shoot the extinguisher at the car, most likely for several seconds, 5. Re-enter the vehicle, and finally 6. Continue from there. Fire extinguishers being what they are, I would imagine a gradually increasing chance to actually put out the fire. Say, 10% on the first turn, increasing 10% per turn to a maximum of 50% (at which point the extinguisher is empty). A fully-engulfed vehicle can obviously not be addressed with a handheld extinguisher. We're talking small-to-mid-sized flames here. And you know what else, me? They don't even have to be red! I'm not all that picky about the color. |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 6, 2011, 2:14 am |
I think you two are onto something there. What, they could even maybe be blue? | ||||||
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Stucky Posted Jun 13, 2011, 8:53 am |
Flak jackets. A little protection from splash damage would be lovely. | ||||||
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*sam* Posted Jan 18, 2012, 1:49 pm |
And when I said soon, I meant 2.5 years later! I haven't done anything very substantial for DW for a while (apart from some wasted work trying to get a few things done) so I think I really need to have a go at this one. I'll have some time over the next week or two... |
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Juris Posted Jan 18, 2012, 5:34 pm |
Awesome, thx Sam! wait for it... And fire extinguishers to assist a crew in putting out fires
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*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Jan 18, 2012, 7:20 pm |
God dam personal fire extinguishers or vehicle equipped ones .... | ||||||
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*sam* Posted Jan 18, 2012, 7:27 pm |
I know fire extinguishers are a popular one. Here's my thinking on it: it is assumed that vehicles already have some sort of extinguishers internally, and there is an automatic fire-reduction check made every turn based on how many active peds are in there. So.. what I think should be added is a carried extinguisher for external use only. | ||||||
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GrowlingBadger Posted Jan 18, 2012, 7:45 pm |
Sniper rifle. Taking out tires, head shots..nice.
GB |
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Necrotech Posted Jan 18, 2012, 8:14 pm |
RpG's, LAW's, ..... .50 Cal Barret (Anti Material rifle) | ||||||
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Joel Autobaun Posted Jan 18, 2012, 8:20 pm |
I agree. |
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*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Jan 18, 2012, 8:39 pm |
OK i can live with that. |
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*Tinker* Posted Jan 18, 2012, 10:12 pm |
sounds cool, could they also be effective against insects? since they are coldblooded? might have a stunning effect?
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*Bastille* Posted Jan 18, 2012, 11:55 pm |
yeah, that sounds cool.
Med kit sounds cool too. As I understand it, an FA specialist must be in the car with the wounded character to stop their bleeding, so a character lying bleeding on the ground is pretty much helpless. |
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Groovelle Posted Jan 19, 2012, 6:11 am |
If we start getting ped equipment there should be an increase in the amount of stuff a ped can carry. Being able to carry one rifle, 4 reloads and naught else is a bit limiting, especially when the stuff will be worn. Maybe a system more rpg-like for how stuff can be equipped. I look back to games like X-com and those fellas could carry a lot of stuff! | ||||||
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Jake Nikodemus Posted Jan 19, 2012, 7:00 am |
Add packs!
-Jake |
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*sam* Posted Jan 19, 2012, 10:46 am |
I'm basing it on one of the suggestions earlier in this thread, whereby a ped can carry quite a lot of bulk, but it increasingly slows them down and reduces their activity level (strength being a factor). |
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GrowlingBadger Posted Jan 19, 2012, 11:38 am |
Nice. whilst you on the subject of peds (and with fear of derailing the conversation!) any chance you can make it possible to pull an unconscious ped out of a car, especially as you can do it to the enemy.
GB |
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*sam* Posted Jan 19, 2012, 12:13 pm |
I can probably do that in the same patch, yep. | ||||||
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FireFly Posted Jan 19, 2012, 12:21 pm |
RPG's have been a long time commin, just sayin'
The barret would be something to be careful with, heavilly limiting the ammo and restrictive weigh would be a must. |
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GrowlingBadger Posted Jan 19, 2012, 12:40 pm |
Claymores and antipersonnel mines? Maybe a bridge too far.
GB |
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GrowlingBadger Posted Jan 19, 2012, 12:41 pm |
I know people have wanted cycles for ages and I think it was mentioned there was a problem with the physics, would quad bikes work? And if they did would anyone use em?
GB |
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*sam* Posted Jan 19, 2012, 12:51 pm |
Quad bikes would work, yeah, they'd be quite a bit of work though - as you say, would anyone use em? | ||||||
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*Bastille* Posted Jan 19, 2012, 1:18 pm |
... the buggy?
I thought weight effected ped movement now |
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*sam* Posted Jan 19, 2012, 1:27 pm |
No, weight is currently ignored by peds.
How does this look? (All values below round down) Max unpenalized Weight: sqrt(strength) x 5 : i.e. 25 str = 25lbs, 50 str= 35 lbs, 100 str= 50 lbs Every percent above that limit reduces speed by 1% (absolute limit is therefore twice the value above) Max unpenalized Bulk: 3+sqrt(2 x weight) i.e. 25 str = 10 bulk, 50 str = 11 bulk, 100 str = 13 bulk Every 1 bulk point above the limit reduces activityLevel by 10% |
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Marrkos Posted Jan 19, 2012, 2:19 pm |
Might also need to implement a 'drop this stuff' command, so peds can lighten their load to run away if necessary.
Ideally, the dropped stuff would generate a Junk Pile that could be retrieved if the ped survives. |
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FireFly Posted Jan 19, 2012, 3:23 pm |
While at it, can you rework the shotgun to be less useless...
But seriously, you need to take another look at weapon weight if you havent already, because as it stands... Shotgun - 15 SMG - 15 (It's 50% heavier than the rifle?) Rifle - 10 Grenade Belt - 10 (5 grenades = Loaded rifle?) Hand Flamer - 8 (shouldnt these be really heavy in comparison to a submachinegun?) Also, bulk... Rifles and SMG's are the same bulk, way I figure the rifle is longer (thereby bulkier?) than the smg, either way the advantage of a short range weapon should be that it's lighter and smaller... currently it's heavier... Submachineguns are not known for their heavy weight
Also... RPG's and Machineguns |
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*Bastille* Posted Jan 19, 2012, 3:41 pm |
Encumbrance stuff sounds really cool. Im going to be encumbered by ped management now
EDIT: {Just saw FFs bit above} yes, current equipment values are a little off  8lbs chainsaw 10lbs rifle?
at a rough guess Id think more like..... grenade belt is 5 grenades, so 15lbs sounds about right 3 lbs each? I dunno, you're the gun nut SMG 5lbs (all be it a really big assault rifle looking one) shotgun / Rifle 8lbs Chainsaw 20lbs probably lots of bulk too by the rules, just because its awkward to carry with anything else. FT 20-30lbs Lots of bulk for same reason as above All these bits and doo dads sound wonderful. PFE, LAW, BA varieties and smoke grenades/grenade launcher would be my first wish on the list I guess smoke grenades - any way the smoke can get bigger each turn or couple of turns? It can dissipate over a period, can this be reversed, so for the surrounding area of the smoke it gains a low level smoke ring, then full smoke ring the following turn, so the smoke grows outwards. starts at normal smoke size, then large, then extra large. |
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Necrotech Posted Jan 19, 2012, 4:08 pm |
Anti Material rifle (Can be used as sniper rifle) Same damage as car rifle, though less shots say 7 or 5 per clip
Backpack or tactical vests for storage RPG/Vlaw/Law... 1 shot then reload The Mechanical and Field Medic kits Extinguishers |
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Joel Autobaun Posted Jan 19, 2012, 6:20 pm |
As the player with probably the highest handguns skill gang I feel it is important to game balance some of these suggestions.
You guys are seriously playing with fire. |
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FireFly Posted Jan 19, 2012, 6:48 pm |
Nah, it would be nice if peds were more of a threat to vehicles without resorting to glitching... |
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Fifth Posted Jan 19, 2012, 7:47 pm |
This. And if something is overpowered, Sam can nerf it again until there's a happy middle ground reached. |
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FireFly Posted Jan 19, 2012, 8:13 pm |
To carry enough would make a characther significantly much slower under the system sam proposed, I'd imagine such a weapon would be balanced that way. RPG's are self explanetory. |
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Joel Autobaun Posted Jan 19, 2012, 8:46 pm |
Ok sure... laser laws and tripod machine guns. | ||||||
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FireFly Posted Jan 19, 2012, 9:23 pm |
And honestly, wouldnt somethink like an MG3 or Saw work better than a tripod? |
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Joel Autobaun Posted Jan 19, 2012, 9:26 pm |
Sure minigun | ||||||
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FireFly Posted Jan 19, 2012, 9:43 pm |
Anyway, compared to a rifle... 50cal Bit longer range, heavier weapon with damage 2-3 per car rifle standards... 5x6 (5 in chamber, 5 reloads) gives 60 - 90 potential damage with better crit chances... LAW - 2 bulk, fires medium rockets... Lets say you get 4-5 of them if you have a strong guy, that's still only 20-30 potential damage from one characther... better splash of course, but still... Our Rifle? 20x6 = 120 potential damage... So yeah, the rifle still wins in staying power, altough I hope it gets changed at some point as to not make all other weapons obsolete |
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Iron Wraith Posted Jan 19, 2012, 11:31 pm |
You guys need to read more.
As depicted rifle = m16 = 8-9 lb loaded. smg = mp40 = 8-9lb loaded. shotgun = pump action m97? = 8 lb loaded. If the car rifle is a recoilless say m67 there is no reason it couldn't be ped operated. Buuuut, the m67 weighs nearly 40lb and is single shot. It's a doozy of a shot mind. If you are talking about something like a .50 cal anti-mat rifle the damage isn't going to be the same as a recoiless rifle, it would be about the same as a single round from a .50 cal machine gun. A burst from an MG strips the armour by repeat impact, a rifle makes one hole. Maybe you get lucky, maybe not most of the car is going to be non-critical components. Remember IRL these are used for taking out cirtical subsystems in stationary vehicles from a set-up position a long way away, not blatting away at the main armour of a moving vehicle from less than 100 yards. I think the figures used are from "another game" TM and thus are faithful to the genre rather than any real world example (as are Joels references to laser-law) Lets not get too over enthusiastic about anti-vehicular peds, this is a car combat game after all. The vehicular weapons are toned down for playability the same toning down should make ped weapons all but useless. |
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Juris Posted Jan 19, 2012, 11:52 pm |
Hmm
Miniguns and mutants, what's next, powered armor? Seriously, hand weapons probably need a re-balance. A rifle should do next to nothing to a vehicle - its only a single bullet. To really damage a vehicle you'd need an RPG. Agree with Joel and Wraith - the idea of multi-shot ped weapons capable of destroying a vehicle in a few hits is playing with fire. If hand weapons are rebalanced I'd love to see assault rifles - but right now anything more powerful than a rifle would be broken. |
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Fifth Posted Jan 20, 2012, 12:05 am |
Not quite. The first tanks were horribly vulnerable once armor-piercing rounds were distributed to the infantry. These bullets would penetrate armor once, and then bounce around the inside of the tank like a ball bearing in a blender until it hit something soft enough to stop its momentum - like a human body. It wasn't until better and thicker armor was developed by WW2 that tanks stopped being vulnerable to infantry.
By this logic, if the Rifle is using armor-piercing bullets, which aren't hard to make - a steel core with a lead or copper jacket around it - then it could conceivably damage or penetrate light armor, especially if the armor is applied in some half-ass workshop by a mechanic who's high off his gourd on Neophedrine. I'd never use an anti-mat rifle on my own peds. An RPG... maybe. Big maybe. But an anti-mat rifle would kinda miss the point of infantry weapons - killing bugs when walking back to town.
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*Bastille* Posted Jan 20, 2012, 12:45 am |
I thought that sounded about right, ok, I got the smg wrong, I was taking a guess
_________________________________
medium rocket for LAW sounds too much. Same as Car Wars, but I think light would be better? It depends how it is going to work. 1 shot 2 shot point and shoot. very inaccurate. If law or some rocket platform for peds. Rocketeer 3 sniper whatever peds sounds risky for 1 or 2 shots. re-loadable in vehicle maybe? no radar guided laser BAzookees with parachutes and safety harness that lets you hold 3 more bulk for 5 less weight equivalent +3 slaver slayer smoke grenades single shot weapon if growing smoke idea works, or else 5 in a belt. Tripod MG and grenade launcher as theres ammo for them
Med kit allows for attempt stop bleeding, the character will try stop bleeding as long as he stays still, command. This equipment is figured standard in a car {bandages, milky way bar, pokimon game} but a kit is needed for the same operation in field. No Super healing of slaver undying level 6. |
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Groovelle Posted Jan 20, 2012, 1:30 am |
Awesome stuff Sam.
Bastille just said something there - weapons reloadable in car. If you start a reload on foot and jump in a car, if you don't switch to a weapon or drive, let it reload the ped equipment. |
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Necrotech Posted Jan 20, 2012, 2:06 am |
Actually in the case of a .50 Cal Barret missing the point of ped weapons.
Against "Soft" targets.... Say Bugs,Animals, and peds The hydrostatic effect alone would sheer pieces off those little buggers in single shot. There is scientific evidence that hydrostatic shock can produce remote neural damage and produce incapacitation more quickly than blood loss effects. For instance, a person hit say in the shoulder, would not only take a single massive shot that would pass straight though them, but the hydrostatic shock but be flaying the skin off the rest of the target while detaching other limbs. Because of the hydrostatic shock that follows a large caliber, high velocity round such as the .408 Chey Tac, the target would literally be peeled apart and limbs would be flying 200 feet away. Make no mistake, a rifle like that is NOT a standard .50 calibur round. |
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*Bastille* Posted Jan 20, 2012, 2:56 am |
Ped weapons will do that now, I was thinking only in car for the whatever it is launcher rocket propelled chainsaw idea. |
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Fifth Posted Jan 20, 2012, 3:47 am |
A RPG-7 (that's what you see being carried by every penny-pinching army-on-the-cheap in the world) can be reloaded on foot. But they can be reloaded while you're carrying them.One person can't carry a lot of rounds, true, but it sounds like a Light Rocket/MML would be an acceptable compromise damage level for one of these.
One idea I was having - what about restocking while in a vehicle. IE, someone fires off all his Crossbow ammo on foot, jumps back into his transport SUV and grabs a couple clips of Crossbow ammo out of the cargo compartment, and hops back out to keep fighting? With the ammo capacity of Rifles this isn't much use, but if RPGs come in, this might be needed. |
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Iron Wraith Posted Jan 20, 2012, 8:46 am |
Necro:
A large calibre hit will mess you up. No argument. Correctly placed in a muscle under tension even a 5.56mm round will tear off a limb (the bullet severs fibres in the countertensioning muscle and the other muscle under tension rips it apart pulling off the limb). There is on record a woman who was killed by a spent .22 bullet fired from nearly a mile away (it passed through the top of her head after comingthrough the top of her convertible) The .50 cal Barret rifle uses exactly the same round as the .50 cal M2 machine gun, it was developed from it. Until the development of the barret the long range sniping record was held by an M2 machinegun fitted with a telescopic sight. The fact that early tanks were vulnerable to rounds developed to defeat them is a bit of a tautology. I am presuming that DW armour is designed to be proof from contemporary handguns (otherwise Evan would be full of chompers loaded down with peds with rifles). You may be able to luckily poke an armour piercing round through light armour (1-2 points), but that doesn't mean a hit on heavier armour would deplete it appreciably, its a small hole. Just because you can poke an armour piercing round through light armour, doesn't mean it would have sufficient energy to damage anything on the other side, or that you wouldn't bury it in super structure, a seat, or some other non-critical component to no effect. |
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FireFly Posted Jan 20, 2012, 10:21 am |
Oh Sam, while at it... If you are going to be putting time towards pedestrian gear read this thread...
http://dark-wind.com/forums2/index.php?a=topic&t=18709 People were mostly in favor of the suggested changes, with some modifications. (Yeah, if there is any one thing I want rebalanced it's hand weapons) |
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Necrotech Posted Jan 20, 2012, 4:09 pm |
Carlos Hathc0ck III USMC ... R.I.P. |
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*sam* Posted Jan 20, 2012, 4:13 pm |
Thanks |
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Necrotech Posted Jan 20, 2012, 4:13 pm |
Here's the thing... all these vehicles are using light armor. Not ablative, not reflexive. Just sheets of steel bolted and welded together. Some may be less quality of other type say a fridge door vs molded composite materials (C vs A Armor), but still light armor nonetheless. Unless Sam starts rolling out APC's, MBT's, and other military vehicles.... Light armor it is. |
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Joel Autobaun Posted Jan 20, 2012, 5:25 pm |
This already happens. |
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Joel Autobaun Posted Jan 20, 2012, 6:15 pm |
White Feather...great shooter. The guy who myth busters said couldnt shoot through a telescopic sight...except it happened. Hathc0ck said he couldn't shoot the Kennedy assassination like Oswald did...things that make you go hmmm. Record held for 30+ years until A Canadian beat it in Afghanistan and then a Brit beat that a few years ago. Using "special" rounds. |
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*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Jan 20, 2012, 6:59 pm |
Then he took an arrow to the knee | ||||||
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Joel Autobaun Posted Jan 20, 2012, 10:06 pm |
The sun even shines on a dog's ass twice a day. |
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*Bastille* Posted Jan 21, 2012, 3:36 am |
Nothing new, but while on the subject of Ped Equipment....
Currently, peds can carry as much as they like after looting piles A chainsaw, sword grenade belt, pistol, Hand flamer, 2 rifles, crossbow, bag of weed and a Reds flag |
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Iron Wraith Posted Jan 22, 2012, 6:23 pm |
Nooooo Bast, don't change that, it's onlt the dream of my foot patrols coming home weighed down with free kit that makes their repeated donation of rental vehicles to whatever wasteland scum feels like taking a pop.
Necro. Armour that can withstand multiple hits from and anti-tank gun and still not be penetrated can by no stretch of the imagination be called light. Your assertion that the armour here is of any specific manufacture is flawed. 10 points of armour is capable of ablatively stopping 10 points damage (with a few frags getting through when it has almost gone). It is not metal, plastic or krypotonite. It is of unspecified manufacture (method or material) and its properties are wholly limited to those that have a game effect. Within those parameters assertions based on "real world" properties are irrelevant. Ped portable weapons should not be capable of doing significant anti-vehicular damage because the NPC gangs do not habitually field roving gangs of peds to support their vehicles. If they don't do it (because you'd need major revisions to the AI routines) player peds should not be able to do it either otherwise you blow balance out of the window. The Barret .50 for reference also weighs in at 30 or so lbs. |
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*Tinker* Posted Jan 22, 2012, 10:37 pm |
cargo compartment.. i like. be even better if you could auto-save what was in it for every scout, things like med kits ammo, riffles would stay there till needed. be a nice way to utilizes small free bulk space |
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*Bastille* Posted Jan 22, 2012, 11:25 pm |
Using that spare space would be good.
I was thinking more that you can still loot till over encumbered but on return to town items over limit should not be able to be taken out again. I wouldn't want to find a chainsaw in a pile but get a message, you can't carry this. That would suck. But theres no point changing this if the new encumbrance rules come in. They will fix this already. Initially I thought this could be a point to exploit. |
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Necrotech Posted Jan 22, 2012, 11:26 pm |
In wars past and present.. but we use World War II as a prime example. There are extremely good reasons that tanks are other armored vehicles did NOT travel alone without infantry. Armor has always been vulnerable to infantry attack, for many reasons |
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Fifth Posted Jan 23, 2012, 12:01 am |
Where is discussion of the new encumbrance rules? I have not seen this... |
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*Bastille* Posted Jan 23, 2012, 12:26 am |
previous page (page 9) a post from sam, up the top
Or I could just copy and paste it huh (uh duh, brain not working today... yeah, yeah I know, thats everyday )
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Iron Wraith Posted Jan 23, 2012, 5:40 pm |
Necro:
Were we playing a WW2 tank and infantry game, your observation would be relevant and whilst a bit obvious might have some value. Can you give me a real world example from a post apocalyptic future where solar radiation has fragmented society and the populance have taken to arming civilian cars in an attempt to extend the influence of their fortress towns? Oh, and the architects of the regressed technology need to have been constrained by a pseudo-religious dogma of fair-play and game balance as well. |
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Juris Posted Jan 23, 2012, 5:57 pm |
Lol, the term you are looking for is suspension of disbelief
Cars with guns - yes Deathsports - yes Tanks and planes - no purely because of game balance since it's the same technology (remember Chrysler made the Sherman) Realistic ballistics - no because realistic shaped charges (Munroe effect) would totally unbalance the game by blowing through armor to fry the crew inside. Why, cause it's based on Car Wars, and it's about cars. Remember what peds were called in CW? Flies. |
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Joel Autobaun Posted Jan 23, 2012, 9:28 pm |
Well Carwars actually did make the mistake of going into hovercraft and tanks and planes. Peds were called "squishies" by Tanks. If I recall Tank armour required something like two 6 in a row to actually get damaged. It was total balls. This thread reminds me of the time we let our "special" friend Jamie play car wars with us. Everyone got a budget of $30000 bucks to buy vehicles and weapons to fight it out on a town map. Jamie didnt know how to design a car and we knew he's have to get one of uncle Al's special pieces of crap but we didnt want to waste time teaching him to make a car. We might have had an idea of what he was doing if we didnt offhandedly answer his question of how many peds can I have? "As many as you fit in your vehicle", we said tersely. So Jamie shows up in a basic bus chassis with a tiny engine and one armor point on each side (he was guessing but it turned out to be legal and had 2.5" accel). In it was 30 peds armed with 1000 bucks of hardware each(some had laws though, some armed with just a grenade to jump off a roof with and land on cars). Jamie won. |
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FireFly Posted Jan 23, 2012, 9:44 pm |
That's an awesome story
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Iron Wraith Posted Jan 23, 2012, 10:58 pm |
Awesome and it has clearly grown somewhat in the telling
I am still hammering my CW players with creative use of peds and cheap anti-vehicle systems (2 heavy rockets on tripod is much cheaper than the common NPC loadout of a pair of LAWs, so much so you can afford to put a laser sight on it, and get the sustained fire bonus and you do 3d6 damage per rocket rather than 2d6 per LAW). Then again if they thought to buy a $40 concussion grenade my peds would be in a very difficult position, so it's less about the kit and more about what you do with it. With infinite skill handgunners and an AI that doesn't really DO peds, you can do too much. |
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Joel Autobaun Posted Jan 24, 2012, 12:04 am |
CW Peds with 6 point body armour were still pussies compared to our peds. | ||||||
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FireFly Posted Jan 24, 2012, 10:13 am |
To be fair, there is an extremly easy way to counter peds...
That, and I bet that people werent as "attached" to the CW peds, heh Herp derp CGL, dead peds |
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Fifth Posted Jan 24, 2012, 5:55 pm |
assuming the ped is in the CGL's area of effect. If the ped's close enough, the CGL isn't going to hit very well. Here's another idea - against peds within 20 meters, all machine guns, as well as the Flechette Gun, the Car Rifle, and the Vehicular Shotgun, get extra damage against peds, or a critical hit bonus. This reflects that shooting someone standing in the open is pretty damned easy when you're using an anti-personnel weapon. |
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*Bastille* Posted Jan 27, 2012, 12:09 pm |
Took a guy out today that had looted piles (I know hes gross). Fired 5 crossbow bolts, another 2 crossbow bolts from looted item, then he had his rifle with 2 clips remaining, and if I wanted a sword to finish them off. All this on a dude that runs at 60mph |
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FireFly Posted Jan 27, 2012, 12:49 pm |
The characther would not be able to move under that weight and would also get reduced activity, given sam gets it working. |
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*Bastille* Posted Jan 27, 2012, 1:32 pm |
Oh definitely, I said that straight away in my initial post.
Just wanted to add a real life example
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*Maxxed* Posted Nov 5, 2012, 3:38 am |
Slightly off topic (but better than a new thread I figure):
Autoconfig for peds - annoying when ya staring a bug in the face and realize that you're outta ammo... |
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Groove Champion Posted Nov 6, 2012, 1:39 am |
Spot on, Maxxed. | ||||||
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted Nov 6, 2012, 1:48 am |
Then again, a CW Ped with the 6 point medium armor (there was a 9 point armor that reduced movement rate to 1 square) could still eat a blast to the face with a .50 Cal HMG and walk away with no permanent injuries. Unless you used an "addon" crit chart of course... Assuming you didnt play by the Rules introduced with the expanded skills list... then a ped could have 9 body + 9 armor for a total of 18 hitpoints... Once fully trained. But that took herculean effort to play and maintain a character long enough to reach skill level 9 in constitution. |
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*Maxxed* Posted Nov 7, 2012, 11:47 pm |
Again not strictly on-topic but i figure the less threads the better...
It would be awesome if you could use Hero Points to gain a bonus to hiring. ...although i have scored a couple of decent chassis from HP (usually in BL) most of the time I spend them on rep as there is nothing useful or no HP items available (especially in SS) I know that some players log in every few hours or whatever the respawn period is for special items but I have neither the time nor the obsessive drive to do this. This tends to mean that the players who spend vast amount of time on DW acquire all the good stuff and the more casual or newer players tend to miss out on the funky stuff available via HP. |
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*goat starer* Posted Nov 7, 2012, 11:50 pm |
i would like to be able to use hero points to hire somebody elses character whose gang is disliked in the town
that would be very funny and its about time our characters got a bit of free will when it comes to chosing gangs |
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*Jagged Monkey* Posted Nov 8, 2012, 4:53 am |
It'd be cool if we could trade characters | ||||||
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*Maxxed* Posted Nov 11, 2012, 6:36 am |
Smoke grenades...and magnetic mines like Mossat uses... | ||||||
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Vroomhoff Posted May 9, 2013, 2:50 pm |
Boon made a good suggestion in another thread. It would be cool if we could buy prosthetic limbs for our guys that get arms, legs and eyes blown out. Perhaps they could regain some activity level this way?
You could put the limb doctor in Morgan or Sarsfield and then people would have reason to make the long trek there. Prosthetics could be the ultimate prize of some event, or just very expensive. |
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*Maxxed* Posted Oct 22, 2013, 4:10 am |
If your gunna go specialist prosthetic I say go the whole hog and go cybernetics! | ||||||
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*Rev. V* Posted Oct 22, 2013, 5:15 am |
I want nuns that shoot lasers out of their eyes!
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*Jagged Monkey* Posted Oct 22, 2013, 6:03 am |
What movie had the girl with the shot gun leg? I want that!
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Grimm Sykes Posted Oct 22, 2013, 9:03 am |
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1077258/?ref_=nv_sr_1 unfortunately it also features a penis melting off a guy, beware |
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*goat starer* Posted Oct 22, 2013, 9:26 pm |
wait till they remove their glasses... 
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Bolt Thrower Posted Oct 23, 2013, 5:22 pm |
Can I get this:
http://guns.wikia.com/wiki/MM-1 With HEDP rounds. Then I can ped hunt for new cars.
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musashi_san Posted Oct 23, 2013, 5:44 pm |
people ped hunt for new cars already without that, some quite successfully. i did that exclusively for a couple months with mixed success.... | ||||||
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Bolt Thrower Posted Oct 23, 2013, 5:44 pm |
And a spike chain might be nice to slow the cars down, too. | ||||||
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Bolt Thrower Posted Oct 23, 2013, 5:45 pm |
Well, I suck, so big badda boom for me. | ||||||
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foxboy1 Posted Aug 22, 2014, 7:21 am |
fire extinguishers would be a great idea is all my cars catch on fire and hand grenades and exoskeletons and insert joke here bug spray dam big bugs ;3 and flamethrowers for your gangsters and swords and axes and sledgehammers and Molotov ####tails | ||||||
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*Boonwolf* Posted Aug 22, 2014, 8:00 am |
Don't forget RPG and chainsaws
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*goat starer* Posted Aug 22, 2014, 8:04 am |
I am confused... if its a joke i don't get it...
If its not then we already have hand grenades, hand flamers, swords and Molotov ####tails. would love to see more bugs in the game (insect kind.. it has had enough of the other kind )... kind of think an HMG negates the need for Knockdown Spray.
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Spynet Posted Aug 28, 2014, 1:05 am |
Drivers racing suits (flame retardant) as well as some type of armor for duelist. If they are made for a specific character as well as being a little expensive it might keep them from being common....? And of course you would need to replace them as they get used and worn out.
Some type of vehicle fire suppressant. Either Fire extinguishers or a built in system to install like you do with roll cages. |
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Fealty Lost Posted Aug 29, 2014, 1:00 pm |
the ability to reload hand weapon ammo from vehicle cargo, just as we can vehicle weapons. | ||||||
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Dr Meat Posted Feb 28, 2015, 10:03 pm |
Was there ever any resolution on the question of body armour for gangers? Its seems odd that they cant wear flak jackets or helmets, given the amount of shrapnel they have to eat. Even if it was rare and expensive and had t obe purchased only from other players who made it or imported it from god-knows-where, it would be a good addition to the game.
Can we have this, please?
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Groovelle Posted Feb 28, 2015, 10:24 pm |
I think the official word is that they are wearing whatever they can find. Otherwise they wouldn't be so resilient (and they used to not be so resilient).
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Dr Meat Posted Mar 1, 2015, 8:35 am |
Hmmm. Ok. | ||||||
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Parapsycho Posted Dec 7, 2016, 3:20 am |
I don't know if anyone actually reads these threads anymore, but...
just got a copy of Car Wars, and they have some pretty good ped equipment ideas. Backpacks- 1 bulk. Adds 5 extra bulk that can be carried. To access them, a ped has to spend one turn taking the pack off, and one turn exchanging items. They can leave the backpack on the ground, or put it back on (one more turn). Toolset- takes up 6 bulk. Increases mechanic skill by 20% as long as it is carried. Improvised tools- takes up 3 bulk, and increases mech skill by 10% Paramedic bag- 6 bulk. Increases first aid skill for stopping bleeding by 20% First Aid Kit- 3 bulk. Increases first aid skill for stopping bleeding by 10% Heavy Flack Jacket - 3 bulk. Increases STR by 50% when determining damage to the pedestrian Medium Flack Jacket - 2 bulk. Increases STR by 25% when determining damage to the pedestrian Light Flack Jacket - 1 bulk. Increases STR by 10% when determining damage to the pedestrian |
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*The X Man* Posted Dec 7, 2016, 6:51 am |
This would be nice for Scavs | ||||||
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*goat starer* Posted Dec 7, 2016, 9:13 pm |
Those are great |
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Hogfather Posted Apr 8, 2020, 1:03 pm |
How bout a damn car jack? Gives a bonus to strength when flipping your car. Can be used as a club in melee combat. | ||||||
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*Maxxed* Posted May 7, 2020, 8:24 am |
Increased bulk for high strength peds. | ||||||
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KingEridani Posted Jan 17, 2021, 5:18 pm |
Ped Armor... PLEASEEEE! | ||||||
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kiemeo Posted Nov 30, 2022, 4:24 am |
*Deleted as SPAM* by Marshal Longo | ||||||
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shotgunner20 Posted Apr 30, 2023, 5:48 pm |
Portable Gatling Gun: 30 rounds,fires twice like the original,takes up about all of the inventory space unless your character is beefy enough to fit a reload(?)
Portable LMG: 20 rounds, fires twice,very heavy with heavy reloads to match Sniper Rifle: 5 rounds, terrible close range accuracy,perfect long range accuracy, expensive ammunition and weight slightly heavier than the rifle |
