Marrkos Posted Mar 29, 2009, 6:56 pm	There are some permutations of this, but the poll question is the crux of the issue.
*Lugal* Posted Mar 29, 2009, 7:09 pm	I'm torn on this issue, as there are pros and cons either way. Right now I'm leaning towards including all, but I'm not sure that's best.
Marrkos Posted Mar 29, 2009, 7:17 pm	Lugal said: I'm torn on this issue, as there are pros and cons either way. As am I. I voted to make all items available, because even a compromise where the event builder has to have the item in order to use it in the event falls in the 'all items available' category. To be clear, I don't care for that specific compromise because it puts some of the usability of DW:T into DW, and I think that limits its effectivity in bringing in players who don't want to play DW.
darthspanky Posted Mar 29, 2009, 7:50 pm	i voted no but maybe we could use what we already have in our weapon or car stocks. you want to use a 5lv8 laser moray in bl you need to own one in bl to use it in tactical. kinda like unlocking weapons and cars for dw tactical by finding and owning one
Marrkos Posted Mar 29, 2009, 8:00 pm	darthspanky said: i voted no but maybe we could use what we already have in our weapon or car stocks. you want to use a 5lv8 laser moray in bl you need to own one in bl to use it in tactical. kinda like unlocking weapons and cars for dw tactical by finding and owning one So, in point of fact, you do want all items to be available, you just want some limits on how they are made available. Personally, I don't think using any portion of Tactical should require playing the gang-management/role playing aspects of DW, but that's just me.
hallen Posted Mar 29, 2009, 8:02 pm	I voted yes, though I am a little bit torn on it too. Though I was left wondering as to who exactly can play DW:T? If non subscribers can, then I am wondering exactly how that helps the game grow - in terms of investment for Sam and growth of the player base......though I am sure there would be a certain amount of wow thats really cool - now I want to get that car to drive in the wild. Though it could work the other way too, oh damn its too hard to think about.
Marrkos Posted Mar 29, 2009, 8:13 pm	*hallen* said: Though I was left wondering as to who exactly can play DW:T? My understanding is that anybody who registers can play.
4saken Posted Mar 30, 2009, 8:11 am	i don't see any problem with having all engines and chassis available. no one is ever going to go "i can use a buzzer chassis in DW:T so therefore i don't want one in the campaign game". and certainly being able to go a little faster but only with a car in the tactical is no big player thrill. at the same time, i don't want to see it become a laser/rgm fest either. but i really don't think that's likely to happen. people use such things in the campaign game for different reasons. having everything available allows us to do things like "assault on the mortar lorry" that we never would get to do in-game. we can be the pirates! yarr! / on an somewhat unrelated note: i would also like to see experimental weapons and chassis available as well. and items! w00t! we need to try some items! // also i think only subscribers should be able to create DW:T games.
*JD_Basher* jd.basher@charter.net Posted Mar 30, 2009, 9:06 am	DW/Tactical should NOT have the 'rare' items included IMO. This different 'theatre' should be "whetting the appetite" for a prospective Subscriber/player. These are PERFECT venues to show new players the game nuances AND also allows Veteran players the PvP aspect the community has been asking for, ie: Level battlefields. Let them see that the rare weapons are available to use but not in this version of Darkwind. Have a short prompt saying that the weapons they selected is not available for use in (Darkwind:Tactical). Or just have the weapons 'greyed-out' and not accessible. Just some thoughts. JD ------------ edit: Just one more thought..... IF the Player MAKING the 'Tactical' event has some of the rare weapons or chassis, he can 'share' the use of the weapons and cars in his own garage for THAT single event. They can build enemy and ally cars with the 'rare' stores he has gained in other encounters. JD
*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Mar 30, 2009, 9:57 am	I voted " yes " souly because i would like to create scenarios where all vehicles and weapons are available, if it is considered none new user friendly couldnt a way of restricting usage for non subscribers be implemented just as in owning vehicles ( subscribe now try out that buzzer, then go in the wilds and try and capture one for your gang etc ) I dont think it should relate to main DW in anyway, including using players own garages ( how would we share templates that way ) that would still only allow the older vets with the rare and virtually unobtainable weapons / chassis to Invest In DW:T
*Ninesticks* Posted Mar 30, 2009, 6:29 pm	Like most people I have been somewhat at odds with myself with which way to vote, but upon reflection I have voted yes and here's why. I don't think being able to use a particular item in DWT will render said item less valuable/sought after in DW. I don't really see how a full DWT would diminish the fun of finding and capturing a rare vehicle/weapon in DW (well not for me anyway). Because of these points I don't feel that already being an owner of said rarity will be diminished either. I think a full DWT offers the best possible background for those wishing to create scenarios and even possibly re-enactments of 'famous' wilderness encounters. I also think it will offer a great taster for the main game too. With all that said, I would think it is however appropriate for access to DWT to be restricted for non-subs, after all most non-sub players are new players and the massive choices available could very well act as a put off as much as a teaser. To what level it would be restricted I must admit to being unsure - perhaps have some set 'training/taster' scenarios that they can access and that is all. My apologies for the long post.
*sam* Posted Mar 30, 2009, 6:51 pm	Quote: With all that said, I would think it is however appropriate for access to DWT to be restricted for non-subs, after all most non-sub players are new players and the massive choices available could very well act as a put off as much as a teaser. To what level it would be restricted I must admit to being unsure - perhaps have some set 'training/taster' scenarios that they can access and that is all. My apologies for the long post. I haven't yet considered exactly how much of DW:T should be available to non-subscribers. At the moment they can do anything that subscribers can.
*jimmylogan* Posted Mar 30, 2009, 8:07 pm	Even though I've not tried DW:T yet, I voted Yes just now. And I disagree with having the "real" garage affect T in ANY way. That defeats the whole purpose... I also agree with the discussion of limiting non-sub usage, but I'm not sure exactly how yet. Perhaps have subscribers be able to setup the event, much like non-subs can't setup a scout? Or have a limited set of events that can be slightly modified by non-subs? JL
Jansan Posted Mar 31, 2009, 12:51 am	It's an editor, a sandbox, and it's for fun! It doesn't affect balance. Keep the e-peen measuring to the real game. At least let people toy around with stuff in a Builder! We can do some really cool stuff and really interesting scenarios with full access! I vote yes!
Jansan Posted Mar 31, 2009, 12:55 am	Marrkos said: Personally, I don't think using any portion of Tactical should require playing the gang-management/role playing aspects of DW, but that's just me. I'm in 100% agreement.
*sam* Posted Mar 31, 2009, 8:20 am	Looks like strong agreement... I'll leave the vote active for another few days before a final decision however.
Flaming savage Posted Mar 31, 2009, 4:32 pm	I tihnk everything vechile and weps should be allowed to give new players a chance to learn what weps go with what chassias.
lordbam Posted Mar 31, 2009, 5:01 pm	Jansan said: It's an editor, a sandbox, and it's for fun! It doesn't affect balance. Keep the e-peen measuring to the real game. At least let people toy around with stuff in a Builder! We can do some really cool stuff and really interesting scenarios with full access! I vote yes!  Agreed nothing is more fun then building an uber rare firetruck and trying it out..... It might even motivate you to pursue your dream and loot one....
Jansan Posted Mar 31, 2009, 7:13 pm	lordbam said: Jansan said: It's an editor, a sandbox, and it's for fun! It doesn't affect balance. Keep the e-peen measuring to the real game. At least let people toy around with stuff in a Builder! We can do some really cool stuff and really interesting scenarios with full access! I vote yes!  Agreed nothing is more fun then building an uber rare firetruck and trying it out..... It might even motivate you to pursue your dream and loot one.... Exactly. That's like the dictionary definition of a win-win situation.
*Diablo Vash* diablovash@gmail.com Posted Apr 3, 2009, 1:02 pm	Yes. Why limit it, it's just a fun little custom tool for players to explorer other parts of the game. It would be like limiting the Custom Event feature to only having basic cars and limited tracks. From what i see it's a great little feature to let players set up little battles to test themself or let them make exciting battles for other players to enjoy. As long as gangs cannot profit from this i see no problem with letting the feature give the person every possible option.
*sam* Posted Apr 3, 2009, 1:42 pm	Yeah I think the vote has gone on long enough and seems decisive (17-9). I'll now make it so you can use any hardware.
*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Apr 3, 2009, 1:53 pm