*sam* Posted Jan 26, 2009, 3:45 pm	* Some changes to arena driving and ‘run away’ wilderness driving AI to hopefully improve them * Fixed (I think) the problem causing some people to not see bullets. Some of the recent crashes seem to be related to particle emitter problems, which I have spent some time trying to fix * You now get an option to "Take Control of Movement Orders" for NPC vehicles on your team in the wilderness (initially this means escort missions, but it's also relevant to the upcoming 'darkwind sandbox' system). When you have taken control, you can tell them where to drive to using 'move to here' and 'waypoint to here', the same as with pedestrians.
*sam* Posted Jan 26, 2009, 4:03 pm	There's a slight issue with turn-based particles at the moment; they're blocking the client from exiting an event properly. Just working on it.
*viKKing* Posted Jan 26, 2009, 4:58 pm	Could you provide us with some kind of information on the particles problem? I'm curious of what's happening.
*sam* Posted Jan 26, 2009, 5:05 pm	Quote: Could you provide us with some kind of information on the particles problem? I'm curious of what's happening. In torque, some particle emitters are attached to objects - vehicles and their wheel dust, projectiles and their explosions etc. When the 'host object' is deleted, the emitters typically stay alive until all of their particles have disappeared, and then they're deleted too. The problem is that in DW many of our emitters are 'turn based' and therefore if no turns are happening then the particles will never disappear and the emitters will never be deleted. The game client waits indefinitely for this to happen... What I previously did was run 25 turn-based moves on the client as you exited to the lobby, to flush out the particles and allow the emitters to get deleted. But I think this may be casuing other problems related to the recent crashes. So I'm trying to do a more correct flush of turn-based emitters without running the whole gameworld for 25 turns.
*Lugal* Posted Jan 26, 2009, 5:51 pm	*sam* said: What I previously did was run 25 turn-based moves on the client as you exited to the lobby, to flush out the particles and allow the emitters to get deleted. Is that why after events there's the delay before the event closes, but not when an event is truced on turn zero? So the new system will simply sweep the particles rather than running them through their course? EDIT: Looking forward to the psuedo-control of the NPCs!
*viKKing* Posted Jan 26, 2009, 10:05 pm	*sam* said: Quote: Could you provide us with some kind of information on the particles problem? I'm curious of what's happening. In torque, some particle emitters are attached to objects - vehicles and their wheel dust, projectiles and their explosions etc. When the 'host object' is deleted, the emitters typically stay alive until all of their particles have disappeared, and then they're deleted too. The problem is that in DW many of our emitters are 'turn based' and therefore if no turns are happening then the particles will never disappear and the emitters will never be deleted. The game client waits indefinitely for this to happen... What I previously did was run 25 turn-based moves on the client as you exited to the lobby, to flush out the particles and allow the emitters to get deleted. But I think this may be casuing other problems related to the recent crashes. So I'm trying to do a more correct flush of turn-based emitters without running the whole gameworld for 25 turns. I got it. Thanks.
*Ninesticks* Posted Jan 27, 2009, 1:57 am	Everything seems to be working ok now. Thanks Sam!
Kime Dennory Posted Jan 27, 2009, 4:55 am	Wow, that explains a LOT! I saw a combat end once with five turns that happened in very quick succession, after the official end of the combat, where one player's car (which was moving and on auto-fire at the end of the combat) continued moving and firing, but could no longer be controlled. This might fix that problem too. -KD
*sam* Posted Jan 27, 2009, 11:03 am	I'm still working on this, I have found some strange memory corruption issues that I'm trying to find the cause of. They're very likely the cause of many of the client crashes and possibly other weird behaviour.
*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Jan 27, 2009, 11:06 am	will it fix goats big headedness
*sam* Posted Jan 27, 2009, 11:14 am	Quote: will it fix goats big headedness Possibly yeah, I think a buffer over-run might be his problem
NilPoints Posted Jan 27, 2009, 12:00 pm	Well this build seems to be more stable for me - but instead of getting regular lockups on the object load I'm getting occasional lockups on the data load instead. I shall blame this on Goat's buffers
*sam* Posted Jan 27, 2009, 12:26 pm	I have just tracked down what seems to be the main offender, causing data to be over-written beyond the end of the Terrain, screwing up memory belonging to whatever came next. This happened during the Loading Objects phase and could certainly cause crashing/locking up, as well as the pervasive 'crash on exit'. Anyway.. I can patch in a quick fix today on the server-side, pending something more complete in the next day or two.
*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Jan 27, 2009, 12:36 pm	Sam your over worked and under paid...hopefully this fix will work
*sam* Posted Jan 27, 2009, 12:44 pm	Np Grog, I enjoy it most of the time I'm reasonably confident that the server-side patch I just made will improve the loading problems people have been having.
*goat starer* Posted Jan 27, 2009, 1:44 pm	*sam* said: I have just tracked down what seems to be the main offender, causing data to be over-written beyond the end of the Terrain, screwing up memory belonging to whatever came next. This happened during the Loading Objects phase and could certainly cause crashing/locking up, as well as the pervasive 'crash on exit'. Anyway.. I can patch in a quick fix today on the server-side, pending something more complete in the next day or two. sam.. yesterday i said i hated you when my third event in a row siezed my computer up completely on load. I now realise that this was an uncharitable thought and in fact i love you.
*sam* Posted Jan 27, 2009, 2:55 pm	Phew, it's comforting to know you're not in the least bit fickle, goat
*goat starer* Posted Jan 27, 2009, 4:58 pm	i am not fickle... i have firm and fixed opinions that are immutable within their temporal parameters. admittedly those temporal parameters may be brief
*Ninesticks* Posted Jan 27, 2009, 6:20 pm	fickle then
The Paranoid Tourist Posted Jan 27, 2009, 8:03 pm	Don't know why but I've had many more client crashes since this patch went live than before. They've occurred during play, loading, and while exiting events. I'm on a Mac running dual 1.25 GHz PowerPC processors and with 512 Mb RAM and 128 Mb GeForce Ti video card. I don't have any particular events. Assume it's been the majority of them since the patch came out. Each time I've been able to get into the event on the second try or to come back in after restarting the client, but it's starting to get old. I'll try to nail down specifics.
*sam* Posted Jan 27, 2009, 8:07 pm	Quote: Don't know why but I've had many more client crashes since this patch went live than before. They've occurred during play, loading, and while exiting events. I'm assuming (hoping) you mean these crashes happened prior to about 6 hours ago when I patched in a server-side fix to one of the prime suspects? Fingers crossed things should be much more stable now.
The Paranoid Tourist Posted Jan 27, 2009, 9:21 pm	Sorry, Sam. They've been at least as bad since. . . if not worse. Crashed twice mid-event between about 20:00 and 21:20 server time. Then crashed again exiting the looting phase for the same event. This'd be event ID S87412, if that helps. I probably just need a re-install.
Seiler Posted Jan 28, 2009, 7:57 am	Haven't had any problems at all...until the recent update, getting CTDs after looting, and CTDs while loading particle intense maps, have tried turning off particles, etc, reinstalling, rebooting.  Pathways into Darkness was the map that was getting me recently, I could watch races and play on other maps, but that one was CTDing me every time at about 10% into DLing Objects. Currently running a Dual 2 Ghz Intel iMac with RadeonX1600
Mad Mike Posted Jan 28, 2009, 8:01 am	in travel encounters when running, even in some races. Ill press space, name will turn green, clock will stop for a few secs, then event will continue. no crashes.
NilPoints Posted Jan 28, 2009, 8:14 am	My crash points have switched back to being CTDs during setup phase and the occasional freeze on exiting the loot screen. This on XP Pro. Quote: in travel encounters when running, even in some races. Ill press space, name will turn green, clock will stop for a few secs, then event will continue. This has been happening to me for quite a while too
*goat starer* Posted Jan 28, 2009, 10:27 am	Sam, I had a freeze and crash yesterday after your fix whilst watching a playback.
*sam* Posted Jan 28, 2009, 10:33 am	There must be problems other than the one I fixed yesterday.. I'm still digging! yesterday's fix certainly wouldn't have made things worse, it can only have helped.
The Paranoid Tourist Posted Jan 28, 2009, 12:44 pm	Wouldn't you have thought that about nearly every patch or update that you've incorporated?
*sam* Posted Jan 28, 2009, 1:37 pm	Quote: Wouldn't you have thought that about nearly every patch or update that you've incorporated? No, I would have hoped.  This patch was just a one-line change on the server, which told the client that there was no additional terrain data coming - the data that was over-running the buffer on the client side. So I'm confident about this one..
Dr Mathias Posted Jan 31, 2009, 1:51 am	*sam* said: * Some changes to arena driving and ‘run away’ wilderness driving AI to hopefully improve them Thanks for adding this sam. I shot a Flame and Marauder all to hell as they came in, but the Antagonist decided to bolt after he saw his buddies get wiped out. It's what I would have done. I had a hard chase on my hands, earned my money that time for sure.
*sam* Posted Feb 1, 2009, 5:41 pm	I played an arena combat the other day, doc, and the improvements there seem to have helped too - specifically to stop them all bunching towards the same point in the map at the start
Mad Mike Posted Feb 1, 2009, 6:32 pm	all good sam, no crashes at all. there are times when it looks like it crashed, a few secs of a hold then back to lobby after event.