Morgan special rules
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*sam* Posted May 2, 2012, 10:01 am |
I'm currently implementing these special rules for Morgan (thanks to Lord Foul for the idea). Fundamentally, what we're looking to do is encourage co-operative (PvE) play, since we have at least one other town (Shanty) where PvP has been encouraged. (The latter may be fixable, I know it's not working too well - but that's for later).
OK.. 1. Morgan is a very isolated place (you'll be cursing Bastille's maps through which you'll have to travel, I think). It's also a small town, hence no gang will be allowed to have more than 5 characters in Morgan at once. Clearly this is quite difficult to enforce, but I think what I'll do is make any surplus characters above 5 there take random injuries (a bit like the beatings in other towns) and sickness/rapid ageing. 2. Morgan is beset by a nasty local pirate faction who disappear into the mountains before they can ever be properly squashed. They attack the town every week (in a scheduled town attack). Players can only join the Militia side in this attack. If the pirates win the attack, the town supplies and player lockups get stolen from. If the militia win the defence, everyone in town gets a nice training boost for the week, including some over-the-cap possibilities. |
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*Bastille* Posted May 2, 2012, 10:19 am |
Works for me 
(this can be altered if abuse outweighs one size 14 loafer.) Really looking forward to this. Great idea LF 
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Tez Posted May 2, 2012, 10:27 am |
Looks good to me, Morgan is the place to train gangers but you can only have so many gangers there. | ||||||||
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FireFly Posted May 2, 2012, 10:50 am |
Good start aside, that means morgan is yet another town that's not pirate friendly? 
I was banking hoping for open gang warfare idea from that other thread myself, with no militia presence
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Serephe Posted May 2, 2012, 11:18 am |
I'm will FF, was kind of hoping for a bit of pirate love.
Still, looks to be an interesting idea, I look forward to it. Probably should fix the problems with militia fights though, last few I've joined have bugged out on me. |
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FireFly Posted May 2, 2012, 11:23 am |
How about this, replace the militia with "Local Gang", if the attacking gang wins they get to take control of the town and become the defenders the next week.
This way, you can have numerous gangs from numerous factions attack Morgan, and give players incentive to fight for the faction they want to remain in control. Way I figure, Morgan would be fought over by the smaller factions, this would allow 1 town to be the home town for both reds, raiders or slavers if they are willing to fight to keep it under that control. |
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*sam* Posted May 2, 2012, 11:39 am |
As I said above, we can work on Shantyville to get a proper PvP town working, but the idea of a town encouraging cooperative PvE seems like a great idea.. after all, more players like PvE than PvP. |
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*sam* Posted May 2, 2012, 11:40 am |
Any idea what happened? Event didn't start up? |
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Serephe Posted May 2, 2012, 12:17 pm |
Yep, came time for the event to start and it just ended. It put me off what was once my favorite kind of event. Haven't tried one in a while but I've heard people still have issues with them.
Pirate vs Militia events have always been pretty boring without a player on the other side though, it's pretty much a duckshoot thanks to the CR being closer between teams than is normal for a player vs AI event. So might want to increase the AI CR to 1.5x or 2x. I'd like to see 10 to 1 odds, but I think I'm in the minority there, since most people don't seem to find death by ambush fun. |
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*sam* Posted May 2, 2012, 12:46 pm |
Yes, I'll make the CR odds more 'normal', thanks for the reminder. In fact, maybe I'll make the NPC force have a substantial minimum size, just to further encourage participation 
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FireFly Posted May 2, 2012, 12:48 pm |
It can be PvE friendly either way, read my post after the original one with that I never intended for it to be a pure PvP town in mind. On a side note, did the "No heavy gear in or out" idea catch on with you any? |
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*sam* Posted May 2, 2012, 12:55 pm |
Gotcha, yeah sorry..
RE heavy goods in/out: nothing decided yet. I'm not sure what people's preferences are here. I guess it could be set up like the Lost Trail used to be.. |
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Serephe Posted May 2, 2012, 12:58 pm |
+1 for a sub-200s.
Group muscles are always more interesting anyway. |
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FireFly Posted May 2, 2012, 1:04 pm |
Hoy, Sub 230's at least 
Anyway, no need to apologize Sam, That just makes things akward for me 
So anyway, the reason I wanted the "Faction war" in that area is so you'd be able to back your faction in the town attack events. Town attack events are PvP by nature anyway given you can take either side. The only real change is that the winning side gets to have their faction take over the town until defeated. This would give players a great reason to, dare I say Cooperate in town attack/defense events to keep their faction in play
That, and Privateers, Raiders, Reds and Slavers have no home town... This would allow players to satisfy their want for a faction home town by fighting over it. |
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*Bastille* Posted May 2, 2012, 1:08 pm |
aren't lawless people (and ostracized Community/Social types) usually too preoccupied with raiding stuff to have a town?
I liked the new pirate starter town (for new pirate players) idea until I thought about it a bit. What is a newbie pirate going to do in a newbie pirate town, hit raider traders? I can imagine racing events to be most exciting, no rules on those roads. Merchants and money are in SS, SS is the place for pirates to be at. SS is a Pirate Haven. There is always a civ, or merchant target to attack in town. I think this is actually set up really well. Is there a Desert Hyenas level, civ or merchant group that can be picked on by new guys? I do though, understand the idea of Pirates fighting over their turf.
Could this be dynamic depending on previous results, or perhaps who is in town? So if there are few people in town for long periods, losing lots of stuff, the CR balance might be reduced, and if the Pirate gang is being beaten up bad, the CR balances rises. Thinking incase it might become a trap town if this difficulty is too hard all the time and you need to wait for slaver raid to get out of town. |
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Serephe Posted May 2, 2012, 1:17 pm |
Don't think that'd be an issue Bas. Even if there was just one vet in town, it's pretty much a garaunteed win regardless of odds.
Know what, screw it, all objections withdrawn, I'm lookin forward to this too much to care. |
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Joel Autobaun Posted May 2, 2012, 1:22 pm |
Can we help the Pirates attack Morgan?
Edit: nevermind I re-read it....can only join Morganbears side. |
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*sam* Posted May 2, 2012, 1:23 pm |
Just referring back to this point. Please note that there are some new (mostly watery) ideas on the new maps near Morgan, and you should be careful not to play on them with anything you're not willing to lose, until we have playtested and tweaked them. |
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*Bastille* Posted May 2, 2012, 1:29 pm |
A very good point. These are Badlands, you should always take care when driving Especially in the water.
Yeah, you're probably right there. That just popped in my head and thought I best bring it up. |
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Juris Posted May 2, 2012, 2:15 pm |
When? | ||||||||
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Necrotech Posted May 2, 2012, 2:26 pm |
Awesome,
When does this become available ? Can you Hire Gangers there or must they all be imported? Marketplace? And what will be the bulk limit per vehicle in and out ? It is accessible from Firelight and Badlands Truckstop or only one of the towns ? |
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*Rezeak* reecestensel@hotmail.co.uk Posted May 2, 2012, 3:24 pm |
I think this is sweet. Everyone seems to be soloing these days and I get kinda lonely, will be good to have some encouraged co-operation. | ||||||||
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Juris Posted May 2, 2012, 3:52 pm |
Don't like arbitrary bulk restrictions - but I'd be in favor of making the road to Morgan so difficult that getting a Lorry through is next to impossible... Edit: Putting my low-cappers on the small bus to Morgan
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Ragnak Posted May 2, 2012, 5:11 pm |
Sounds cool.
Not so keen on allowing training over a gangers cap though. Seems to make having a cap pointless. Rags |
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FireFly Posted May 2, 2012, 5:42 pm |
People solo for a reason thou, one of them for me is that a group can never coordinate as well as an indivudal controlling several cars. | ||||||||
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JS Posted May 2, 2012, 6:04 pm |
He said a possibility, and I'm sure it is veeeery slow. |
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*Ninesticks* Posted May 2, 2012, 6:21 pm |
I don't need no steenkin' maps to curse Bast
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Groove Champion Posted May 2, 2012, 9:01 pm |
No comment on the implemented rules yet. I'll reserve judgement until after I've tried Morgan.
I don't want to get carried away about something without properly understanding how it plays out - like what I did with Scavenger. |
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*sam* Posted May 2, 2012, 9:54 pm |
Slow, as JS said. Also it will still be subject to a (higher) cap, maybe 110% what it is in other towns. |
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted May 2, 2012, 11:56 pm |
Sounds great to me!
The lower per-car CR makes sense too... more dogfighting = more skill use = more training. Now then... let's have a look at this map.
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*Bastille* Posted May 3, 2012, 12:30 am |
We do have training vouchers already.... so, going over cap is already there.
as for road, hard is good, and Im fine with road caps. I have not driven the lost trail since then, can't wait till someone loses a lorry on that road.
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted May 3, 2012, 6:57 am |
Usually these happen when im at work. But i was able to join 2. In the first it didnt start and my car was listed as travelling back from gates for about a week or 10 days. Bast helped me get that resolved. I think Sam had to manually do something. On the second I would have been slaughtered if the AI hadnt been more interested chasing the fleeing Militia AI back towards town and abandoning his 1 demo vehicle for me to pound. The biggest issue I have is that I cant join them due to them always being at the same TIME of day. I would rather see one day a week where there are multiple smaller attacks over the span of the day so all of us can join in instead of just those people lucky enough to be off at the 1 time of day they occur now (1 hour after I arrive at work) |
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted May 3, 2012, 7:08 am |
I say I'd like to see Pirate Peds attacking the town, with a town map to Ped fight them on... But with a 5 man maximum that would be a real fast way to lose all of your gang.
I also hope the objects that cause lag, such as something in SS (I think the big apartment buildings), the pumps in Elms, the church on Deadman's Drop, are left out of morgan. Those 3 things make some situations very very hard to play through. I know which ways to face the camera to not look at the objects but it still makes certain situations nearly unplayable if something goes wrong. |
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*sam* Posted May 3, 2012, 7:44 am |
This is a fair point. I have already implemented code for a failed defence assuming one event per week, but I'll go and edit it now to be 66% less punishing, and will schedule 3 events per week. Would Saturdays suit? Server times 12:00, 20:00, 04:00 ? edit: or would 1 event per week be better, but at a randomly chosen time? edit: I'm going to stick with 1 per week, but make it randomly chosen Sat/Sun 12:00, 20:00, 04:00 |
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*sam* Posted May 3, 2012, 7:46 am |
BTW.. obviously there's currently some bug with the launching of town-attack events. I'll see what I can figure out.. | ||||||||
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Wolfhound Posted May 3, 2012, 9:04 pm |
Might it not be possible for these newer pirates to have some basic garage setup way back there in the hills, allowing them to modify the basic loadout of the vehicles. ie. no standard NPC vehicles Would allow for the use of weapons only seen in town events to be encountered in the wild. Also, would help to keep the player gangs guessing as to what they are up against when an attack happens. Another thought: Would also allow for a player car to be put back into play by the bad guys allowing for it to be recaptured. But beware, it's weapons mix might be completely different than what was on it before. (Not sure if this one would be possible though) |
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*Tinker* Posted May 3, 2012, 9:09 pm |
can we have that for all of Evans ? 
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted May 3, 2012, 9:49 pm |
Im not sure what peak player times are on the server. I for one work Thurs-Mon. With Tue-Wed off. Sometimes I cant play Wed due to too much to do. Due to work times my sleep-wake pattern is abnormal. I get to play events on DW between 0730 server and 1030 server any night. The COE times worked great for me. (0800 and 1000 I think they were). Maybe one of the random times at 0800 Sam? I know we had decent turn out in COE I so this would probably work well as one of the time. If code isnt too troublesome. Idk how u have it set up. | ||||||||
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*Bastille* Posted May 3, 2012, 10:02 pm |
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted May 4, 2012, 2:09 am |
Regarding pirate v. militia event times...
Perhaps having a half-dozen start times in a regular rotation (as opposed to randomly occurring) would be more effective. That way people can plan for the events that land in their "play-window" and not worry about it in the weeks where things are starting up at 5am in their world. Also, as this will be the core experience for those in Morgan, I'd like to suggest one "enhancement" to the pirate/militia combat: Not always -- heck, not even often -- just sometimes, just occasionally enough to where it's a thorn in the back of players' minds, keeping 'em on edge throughout the battle, there should be another wave of pirates. I see it coming toward the end of the initial skirmish, and I see it being a very serious threat to the well-being of the players. When these guys show up the players should be seriously overmatched and the option of abandoning the fray and running like hell should be a real consideration. It'll make us think. It'll be a gut-check for the guys that are out there. People will die. And it will be epic, scary fun. |
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*Bastille* Posted May 4, 2012, 2:13 am |
yeah, 2nd spawns could be good. | ||||||||
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted May 4, 2012, 8:05 am |
I also liked the suggestion that it not always be "pirates" that attack. That it be a faction that changes occasionally. I have a thought on how this can be determined. Sort of inspired by Pirates of the Burning Seas in a way.
In PotBS towns were affected by people hunting ships in that area. Somehow this affected Town control battles but i never really got that deep into it. But the mechanics of it was that if say a French Faction player sunk some NPCs, that town would get French Conquest Points (or something like that). Or the faction you attacked lost points if they had some. My though it that the players who scout in Morgan could accumulate Control Points rather than Hero Points. These points then used to determine what faction tried to take over the town. Probably the faction with the fewest points? I havent really though it through from a design outlook. Just Musing over it really. I suppose the downside would be that it could allow players to manipulate what faction attacked... or maybe that would be good because then if Bast got reds his reds to attack, or Juan his Muties, people who have a bone to pick with those factions would be all the more likely to join the fight against them. Could provide a real motivation to participate. |
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Joel Autobaun Posted May 4, 2012, 1:32 pm |
One faction would attack NPC ships of another faction's near one of their town and once you got to like 1000 a small red circle would show up on the map around it...which meant ANY player could be attacked (pvP'd) in that red circle and it told everyone that faction was getting attacked at that town and they could go there and fight the attackers (usually an elite group of 6 best fighters of the enemy faction). If uncontested it would get to 5000(a HUGE red circle) then10000 points fairly quickly and a scheduled port attack would happen. The first 30 players to join each side on the port attack time - got in a MASSIVE ship battle which was hard to escape. Certainly not a game for carebears until changes ruined it, to their liking. Sometimes we Pirates would get a bunch of towns near Tortuga big red circled and never go to 10000points - simply keeping the whole straights between cuba and antiqua red to prey upon Europeans as we liked. Usually we attacked towns on the periphery of this very busy central zone. |
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*jimmylogan* Posted May 10, 2012, 3:37 pm |
When does this take affect? I have 5 guys riding in but won't be there till well after midnight. I have 2 guys there now which I'm happy to move OUT, but wanted to see if they could die on the track first.
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*sam* Posted May 10, 2012, 4:49 pm |
It's all done at training time, Jimmy. That's Friday morning, around 4am server time | ||||||||
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*jimmylogan* Posted May 10, 2012, 4:58 pm |
Thanks Sam - not till 10 AM server time, so I'm good.
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Fifth Posted May 10, 2012, 6:11 pm |
About the 5-man maximum: when and how does that get applied? Say I have 4 people in town, but then I bring in a 3-man courier squad, but they're back out before training time hits, does it still count? | ||||||||
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*sam* Posted May 10, 2012, 8:22 pm |
No, it's only checked once per week, at training time. Only at that time can anyone benefit from having excess gangers in Morgan, so it's also at that time that any over 5 will get the ill effects of sleeping out in the snow. | ||||||||
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*Snipe* Posted May 11, 2012, 1:24 am |
I also wondered since we cant bring SUVs in and cant get them made there - what are we to do with the looted ones. Only sell them? | ||||||||
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Serephe Posted May 11, 2012, 1:25 am |
Apparently we can bring SUVs. Which means there's really not much point having the limit at all if that's true. | ||||||||
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Fifth Posted May 11, 2012, 1:30 am |
It does keep TTs and Box Vans out. Which is gonna constrain our logistics a bit. I think the 5-man limit is more important than the size limit, which keeps people from having private armies and kinda forces players to work together to have large battles. 5 crew is a 2-SUV cap. |
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JS Posted May 11, 2012, 3:46 am |
The potential extra training above cap, I assume that means we have to have the capped skill set to train?
Did the militia win this week? |
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*Bastille* Posted May 11, 2012, 6:42 am |
Was there one thins week?
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*sam* Posted May 11, 2012, 8:32 am |
The events haven't happened yet, the 1st ones should be next week. I'll add a note to the Morgan town page to explain things.
edit: ok, done. Is this wording ok?
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*Bastille* Posted May 11, 2012, 9:18 am |
already capped skills will not train? They must be training in that skill, not just field training? eg gunner skill boost for using RL in fight? |
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Ivan Kerensky Posted May 11, 2012, 10:13 am |
Hi,
about vehicules lost when a defence fail. Does it also apply to boarded vehicule ? so if you want your gangers safe you'd better dismount them after each ride ? |
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*Bastille* Posted May 11, 2012, 10:31 am |
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*sam* Posted May 11, 2012, 10:41 am |
No, they can actually train above the normal cap too (but not too far above it) |
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*sam* Posted May 11, 2012, 10:42 am |
Thanks for the reminder.. it will count for boarded vehicles, yes. But I'll write code to eject them automatically from their cars in this case. |
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*Bastille* Posted May 11, 2012, 12:49 pm |
having them taken as hostage would be kinda cool too, need to get them back next defense at loot. | ||||||||
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Ivan Kerensky Posted May 11, 2012, 1:55 pm |
Except the gang firepower in this area is mesured in gangers more than cars.
so you start a vicious circle as losing gangers make you more prone to lose more. And bringing gangers from other town to get them back could be troublesome as if you win you will pass over the 5 gangers limit and get injuries and thus to your gang... |
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*sam* Posted May 11, 2012, 2:27 pm |
How so? Maybe you misunderstood.. if a car with a ganger in gets stolen, the ganger remains in Morgan, not in the car anymore. |
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted May 11, 2012, 2:39 pm |
SAM: Re: Wording: "...liable to getting ill..." is pretty darn clunky. How about "may become ill" or, if the possibility is very high, "will become ill."
Response to "Vicious circle of gangers" post and reply: I think he was specifically referring to Bast's "hostages" scenario, in which case things could certainly become complicated. (Unless hostages still counted toward your 5 Morgan gangers, in which case all is well! sort of...) |
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Ivan Kerensky Posted May 11, 2012, 2:49 pm |
Not answering to you Sam, but to the suggestion than the pilot would been kidnapped
Should have used quote 
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*sam* Posted May 11, 2012, 2:57 pm |
Ah, good!
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*Bastille* Posted May 11, 2012, 2:58 pm |
yeah, in the case I state that gangers would be taken hostage. I had not thought of that ganger hole point though. edit: ahh right, snap |
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*goat starer* Posted May 11, 2012, 7:39 pm |
May I just say how nice it is to see Ivan back again. | ||||||||
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*SirLatte* Posted May 11, 2012, 7:54 pm |
Just thought of another special feature Morgan...or maybe Elms could have... Stops or reduces the Weakening or Deteriorating Fast. Would Give these gangers a chance to get played in places other than Death Races
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Serephe Posted May 12, 2012, 12:43 am |
Heck no -- they're still playable everywhere, folks gotta die sometme. Leaving them sittng n town besides races just wastes the time you've put into them! | ||||||||
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*SirLatte* Posted May 12, 2012, 1:16 am |
When you are limited on time to play you play guys that still have potential...At least thats how I do it |
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Serephe Posted May 12, 2012, 1:57 am |
Everyone has potential, now if you're talkin about guys who still have training left to do, well, what's the point in training guys if once they're done you ain't gonna use them? Ageing is slow enough without making it even slower. Got muties in their late 20s that still have 5+ game years left in them, and that's MUTIES!
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted May 15, 2012, 11:17 pm |
Most of my Humans end up "weakening" or "Deteriorating Fast" somewhere around the age of 17 to 19. Unless They were older than that when Hired. |
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted May 15, 2012, 11:26 pm |
Ok I have a major bone to pick after seeing the Pirate attack times. The morgan town info says i can "Lose" entire cars if the attacks are not beaten off.
But the attacks all occur on the same day, (a day I work, Saturday, the PEAK business day in the US. not sure of people in other countries get that day off but here, only politicians and bankers and non-economy driven industries like factories have that day off) Even worse, the attacks occur at 3 times, 1 during the deep part of my "night" (3 hours after i go to bed to get my nightly 6 hours sleep befor going back to work). and the other 2 while im at work. Can't we put one at 8:00 server instead of 12:00 server? ANY day of the week I can protect my assets at that time. Otherwise I have to make a decision. Im either going to have to totally ABANDON Morgan altogether, Only stock it with junkheaps like a cadrona or something, or just watch my valuables and cars go "poof" without the ability to do anything at all to influence that. Right now I am leaning strongly towards evacuating and abandoning the town and not returning. |
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Juris Posted May 15, 2012, 11:35 pm |
Was thinking about this - my idea would be to make pirate attacks like camp attacks - set a time but allow them to be played early (anytime during the week). If you want cooperative play you can require more than one human participate. As things are now I think the chance the small player base will miss any of the three town attacks is pretty high. |
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Lord Foul Posted May 16, 2012, 4:50 am |
Keep in mind that this is a trial period and Sam may adjust the times depending on how they turn out. I suggested multiple options for Sam to use for times and he went with what he feels is the best times to run the events. Will some have problems attending, sure. But the main point is for the community to work together as a whole, not as an individual Rambo thinking that if he can't make it to the event, the town is doomed. It's a group effort and those involved need to work together to make sure the town stays safe and you get your training bonus. There's nothing stopping players setup in morgan from posting a thread of who will/may show up to these events so we all know that at least some players will be there to defend. |
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*sam* Posted May 16, 2012, 9:31 am |
As LF says, this is a trial period, and things can be changed. I'll re-state something: don't send out anything to Morgan for the moment if you're not willing to lose it.
It's about co-operation: the community as a whole will have to win the three combats, but there's no requirement for any particular player to be at any specific combat (or indeed any at all). |
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*DoubleTap* Posted May 16, 2012, 1:16 pm |
Forgive the digression! Huge retail day, absolutely, and also hospitality industry. There are other "economy driven" industries (factories most certainly included), however, that do not rely on Saturdays to do business- industirals (as mentioned), medicine, financial, education to name a few. I would not limit Saturdays to politicians and bankers. No bone to pick here, Crispin, as I've worked my share of Saturdays too. Plus, I agree completely that retail and hospitality kill it on Saturdays, but most info says about 35% of Americans work on weekends, including those who's job is primarily during the week, but who sometimes come in on the weekends to get some extra stuff done (like me.) Having rattled off all that long-winded drivel, having all the attacks on one day will probably be changed in the long run, because as you pointed out, it makes tons of sense. |
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Juris Posted May 16, 2012, 4:35 pm |
Do you need to be actively training the capped skill to get a boost? | ||||||||
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*Jagged Monkey* Posted May 16, 2012, 6:14 pm |
Yea, I'm gonna need you to come in on Saturday...
I have to work Saturdays too but I don't whine about it. Will vacation mode protect your cars from pirate attacks? |
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted May 17, 2012, 9:31 pm |
By "factories" being "non-economy" driven I meant that they are a producer of goods and dont sell them there at the plant (normally). Usually their goods are then distributed to some distributor, then parceled out to contractees or general retailers to sell, or if it isnt an end product, to some other user to use in thier areas.
Meant no offense to factory employees. I hadnt heard that only 35% of American worked on weekends. But then again American statistical stuff they talk about in the news say we make "on average, over $18.00 an hour" which is blatantly false for the majority of Americans. Its that word average. Take the guy who makes 20 Million a year and average him in and you get a skewing effect. 1 guy makes 20 mil, the other 99 make 25k and poof "americans on average make 220,000K a year!" says the news. LMAO. (actually the news claims the average American makes 180,000. which is again totally insane and untrue for the majority of American. Again, the word average gets it.) Anyway, I just would rather see a 8:00 server time one one attack. So I can attend. I hate to lose my stuff if I had no way to prevent it at all. THIS week I can. Im on vacation. I may just stock morgan with only Dune buggys and Subcompacts. SNOWBUGGY!
anyone have snow camo skins? |
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*Bastille* Posted May 18, 2012, 2:10 am |
yeah I think the stats are more anyone under the top 1% gets 30K average. Its less than here. Minimum wage is like $4/hour or something ain't it.
GO capitalism  99% of the population is on the poverty line. I'd be occupying the streets for sure, just to p!$$ JD off if nothing else
{Im not serious of course JD }
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*Tango* Posted May 18, 2012, 2:20 am |
A lot of injuries will do that, have they taken a lot of lumps? |
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iIIyB Posted May 18, 2012, 3:19 am |
Just a heads up, i was over the ganger limit in morgan the other day, so i moved 3 guys out. havnt been able to process the travel yet so even tho they are "traveling" they havnt left town and got the 25% hit to health.
Make sure your all the way outa town before trainin hits! |
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*Bastille* Posted May 18, 2012, 10:35 am |
Got my cloths sorted, 
now just the cars. Bah, stuff the cars, I'll stick this GG on my shoulder,.. and use uranium tipped ammo to keep em warm had to nick off to an alternate universe again for brief sanity relief (bah, that was meant to be a link to my CO characters, not the main page >:/) They totally changed it over my 3 month absence. I'm now totally insane again and ready for the 2063 season.. well, nearly
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*DoubleTap* Posted May 18, 2012, 1:14 pm |
With tire chains and snow tires! |
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*DoubleTap* Posted May 18, 2012, 1:22 pm |
Bas, in the US, minimum wage is over $7/hour, I think. The median US houshold income (meaning half the households in the US make more, half make less) is a little over 46 grand. As for JD, you're on your own with him! |
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*Bastille* Posted May 18, 2012, 1:38 pm |
woot!  $7
for a semi-educated guess, I was not too far off Not really comparable to here as the cost of living is cheaper in your country Im pretty sure. As for JD, that fury marmot will just have to crawl out of his hole to abuse me personally {still using that one Niner, good call that}
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*DoubleTap* Posted May 18, 2012, 4:37 pm |
Your guess was about half! That's close in Oz?
Continue to poke JD with a sharp stick at your peril! |
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*Bastille* Posted May 18, 2012, 11:18 pm |
yeah, bugger all in australian is still bugger all. | ||||||||
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*sam* Posted May 19, 2012, 11:00 am |
Yes. It doesn't have to be actually at the cap to see a benefit. Here's how it actually works: 1. The skill you're trained in is checked against your cap. If you're over 50% of the way there, training amount is reduced proportionally. This becomes zero at the cap. 2. In Morgan, when the bonus is on, your cap is considered to be 115% normal. |
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*Bastille* Posted May 19, 2012, 12:43 pm |
ahh! many thx
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*Splash* Posted May 19, 2012, 1:30 pm |
Whoa! Did Sam just give us a glimpse of the gears that drive DW? |
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*Rezeak* reecestensel@hotmail.co.uk Posted May 19, 2012, 1:30 pm |
He's probably lying, you know what he's like
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*sam* Posted May 19, 2012, 1:32 pm |
LOL | ||||||||
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*Bastille* Posted May 19, 2012, 1:54 pm |
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Juris Posted May 19, 2012, 5:48 pm |
Ha - I thought the same thing I have always suspected... thanks Sam, good to know the stuff I put in the Wiki isn't wrong
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*Bastille* Posted May 20, 2012, 1:20 am |
It seems 2nd morgan defense failed last night, I think Im missing a few bits and bobs, at least a bucc that I know of. Not sure where to find record of this though. (there is now a pretty horsey out there somewhere for people to find )
Is there any chance something could be added to the activity page? |
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*Bastille* Posted May 20, 2012, 3:11 am |
3rd attack auto truced. Not sure what happened there | ||||||||
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Lord Foul Posted May 20, 2012, 4:41 am |
1200 server one? Was that due to no one showing or did the players lose the battle? We'd have to give it a few weeks for players to get their crews/equipment there to see if the times of the events are working well. I will be sending a crew there this week, though even if I did have a crew there I would have missed all the events due to working today. |
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*Bastille* Posted May 20, 2012, 5:35 am |
there were 4 players, one was absent so we had to wait for it to count down at spawn (I took control of Tez's car (and would have played honourabley, even if he makes Blow Noises Blow noses? something like that) ), once spawn was over and enemy visible, event autotruced.
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*Splash* Posted May 20, 2012, 5:38 am |
Yeah, 2 1/2 hours later, it still says my Apache is "travelling," but it's not in a squad, and none of my gangers are in it. Must have gotten buried in the snow or something... Send the giant mutant St. Bernard dog! (As an aside, I'm looking forward to the "creatures" here in Morgan. Giant polar bears, killer penguins, maybe a mutant baby seal to club...) |
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Lord Foul Posted May 20, 2012, 6:41 am |
On a related topic,
A word of advice for those planning on going to Morgan, the wilderness maps on the way there are quite challenging and it took me 45 minutes to move 4 cars across 2 maps. Roads are barely defined and at times it is easy to get confused, lost or find a proper route of escape. The toxic map is like blowing in the wind, but with toxic lakes everywhere. You could easily lose cars on this map as I'm sure a few already have. The pirate map is like a night version of the maze. Visibility is limited and everything looks the same in a creepy sort a way. |
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*Bastille* Posted May 20, 2012, 7:21 am |
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*Tinker* Posted May 20, 2012, 9:38 am |
yeee! we still have our car! | ||||||||
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JS Posted May 20, 2012, 9:40 am |
lol, stole my looted van back. | ||||||||
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*sam* Posted May 20, 2012, 10:29 am |
Grrr.. bugs. Sorry. I'll investigate later today! | ||||||||
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*Bastille* Posted May 20, 2012, 10:57 am |
to be expected with such a huge addition I don't think any ones been put out by it
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*sam* Posted May 21, 2012, 9:19 am |
According to the game log, the *pirate* team bountied out. Weird.. as far as I can tell, this can only have been initiated by a player, which is of course impossible since no players were in the pirate team. edit: actually no, not weird at all. There is auto-truce code for PvP events when no-one logs in on one side or the other and when the event start time has fully counted down without the combat starting. In this case, obviously, no-one logged in on the pirate side. Anyhow, I can put in an easy fix to stop this happening again. The 2nd defence was unsuccessful, as suspected. There should have been a note in the Gazette to this effect, but a minor bug (now fixed) stopped that. |
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*Snipe* Posted May 21, 2012, 6:22 pm |
Speaking of Morgan, I have an issue........my first run to Morgan with a pho and I got chased into town while I escaped. And the one chasing me was driving on the iced over lake that runs thru the town. So now on my second run to town with my flail I try to do the same - and sink - and demo.
I also remember the rules for demo-ing underwater were changed. Now I have lost 2 cars to it - the first was in Toxic Wastes and I attributed it to just being toxic. But now I see the truth. Has there been an announcement that we are demoing underwater again? And how is it that a NPC can drive on the ice and I cant? It just makes me wonder if I missed something. |
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*SirLatte* Posted May 21, 2012, 6:31 pm |
As far as I know not demoing under water was for the Ralley events...
one of 2 things was done. Option 1- All Gates maps were made so no demoing under water for the ralley events... If this is the case...Then Id guess that since Morgan is new that hasnt been changed yet. Option 2- Only during Ralley events is the Demoing under water turned off Im sure someone will clarify which it is |
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*Splash* Posted May 21, 2012, 6:53 pm |
Got my ride back. Thanks Sam! | ||||||||
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Juris Posted May 21, 2012, 7:02 pm |
The new Morgan maps pretty much require underwater driving, which demos a lot of the NPCs.
First - love the maps Bas
But... Cars driving fully underwater are SILLY because it is so impossible it ruins immersion (haha). I really think the code for this needs to be changed to make this more realistic (ie your car stops, engine dies, and you need to swim) - these maps should have fords across the water
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*sam* Posted May 21, 2012, 7:58 pm |
It's option 2. No rules were changed in any other situation, and indeed have been the same way for 3 or 4 years: a car underwater for 5 turns gets a dead engine and the characters escape or surrender. |
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*Snipe* Posted May 21, 2012, 9:56 pm |
Ah - gotcha. I was there for the change in the rally, but havent checked it in normal travels. Thanks for clarifying. | ||||||||
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*Bastille* Posted May 21, 2012, 10:32 pm |
yeah that could work, although after seeing FEs totally submerged in the water, I agree that its probably best to lower the level a bit. It is a bit deeper than I wanted it to be. Hard to tell in the builder. |
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*Longo* Posted May 22, 2012, 2:28 am |
God - This is 5 consecutive turns correct? |
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JS Posted May 22, 2012, 3:23 am |
Except in a couple cases which seem to be in relation to very deep water/oil and particular vehicles when they are turtled. The Motorhome, Lorry and Van are particularly resistant to demo-ing in water while turtled. |
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*Bastille* Posted May 22, 2012, 3:30 am |
yeah thats right. I believe popping out of the water and back in again within this time, will reset the count.
Id have to go to another PM to find the exact, I think 90% of car for 5 turns, not sure how angle effects that. I lost a voyager on Toxic thinking I would be safe that turn, and less than 90% of my car submerged but at an angle, with the front and motor well clear, and the left door, but half the boot and right door still submerged (tilted right and up 30-degrees both planes). I think that was on turn 5 with 50% seemingly of my vehicle and that turn it demoed. EDIT: And yes, maps like Oil Slick, the oil is only so thick, so you can drive around underneath the oil. Swamps of Dagon... anyone have trouble losing cars there? Swamps should be very hard to drive through, I was thinking of trying to make the fluid with a higher density and viscosity, if that works (and makes sense, I always mix that up, high low) so cars would stop as in a boggy marsh, but then cars would die everywhere(?). |
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*Splash* Posted May 22, 2012, 6:10 am |
The swamps are already hard enough, unless the AI is going to have the same problems. Not really sure you should be able to drive a Viper--excuse me, a Vampire--through a swamp, under any circmstances. | ||||||||
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Lord Foul Posted May 22, 2012, 7:52 am |
Few more comments about new maps.
1-Just did a test on the Morgan speed track, the tyre damage area at the 3/4 on this track is out of control. If you are going to keep it like this, I suggest changing it to a matching rock pattern seen on the other maps/tracks. To lose all my tyres like that, I'd have to be going very fast on the gateway oval track in an exotic at the 1/2 way point. I can't see a town with limited resources or a race sponsor wanting to replace massive amounts of tyres each race due to that one spot. They'd smooth it out or put flaming barrels there so the racers would avoid it. Some rough area is fine, but it all appears to be in one area that does not even look like rough terrain. 2-Morgan figure 8 should have more markers, barrels etc..to guide the racer in the right direction, like the Morgan speed track has. 3-Gates of Morgan map question: Any reason why visibility has to be so poor just because it is snowing? There appears to be no wind, but past 100m it looks like a blizzard. The dead land map has ash falling from the sky, but visibility is still very good, which shows off the beauty of the map. Even the Firelight maps with all the stuff going on around there still has good visibility in most areas. Morgans gate map on the other hand is one big blob of fog and there's no way to enjoy the view of this map. It's like the original maze map on steroids before Sam dialed it back so we could see what was going on. |
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*sam* Posted May 22, 2012, 8:55 am |
Thanks LF - some good observations there.
What I'm going to do is put an 'above vehicle message' showing you when your car is considered underwater and for how long. It is indeed 5 *consecutive* turns to destroy the engine. edit: done |
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted May 22, 2012, 10:00 am |
Not true at all. Most americans make between $18k and $37k with the vast majority being in the general area of $28k Average Mortgage/Rent runs around $9k a year. Utility costs, I wouldnt know, I have Solar Panels and Water Reclaimation devices, Dont use my A/C, Keep my windows covered with Quilts, Keep the heat set to 58 degrees in the Winter, Burn Candles for light and heat in the winter... I seriously ROUGH IT, so my utilities only run me about $125 a month max. Supposedly most americans pay 4 or 5 times this amount though. Then there is the mandatory by law car insurance... average of $1000 a year for minimum coverage (or more), Car Payments (idk how much these may be, I havent got a car loan since 1989), child support (25% of your pre-tax income) and of course tax which varies from 24.5% to 27.5%. But the only people I know who make what you call the "Median" income are teachers or lawyers. Im sure there may be others but I only know people who do managerial work, teach, or are lawyers. But again, Median is based on an average of the whole and the big guys at Morgan Stanley and Bank of America who give themselves $2 Billion dollar bonuses for losing all your money for you are counted in that average |
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted May 22, 2012, 10:13 am |
I didnt even know about the Underwater demo thing until the toxic map. Tried to cross a river and demoed. In the past (not on this map) I have fought entire battles underwater because I couldnt get out. I think it was on one of the Badlands or maybe Texan maps with Oily pools on it. I know for sure I spent a dozen turns (maybe more) pounding with an enemy on one. I remember countin 12 rocket hits and thinking it was the most I ever took before demoing. The vehicle had ony 1 rocket launching thing. MML maybe it was... not sure. Anyway, I lost a Pho in the toxic waters with no shots fired but im pretty sure I was under longer when Bast and snipe and I ran a scout on it and I couldnt see my Yellow Stormer in the Yellow water. I was getting shot though... Is there a feature that makes it not count as a turn underwater if you get hit by weapons fire? |
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*sam* Posted May 22, 2012, 11:26 am |
You're only 'underwater' when the vehicle is 90%+ submerged | ||||||||
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*Bastille* Posted May 22, 2012, 1:28 pm |
I did a few more laps of this the other day, I was worried about it, but but after a few reasonable laps Im confident in the placing of the rocks. They are quite important to the track, and its more than possible to race many, lines. - just following start finish, theres a heavy section over the bump. - 1st corner theres a patch inside line under the snow,, then following out of the corner a strip that is quite tame - then the ice lake - to stop people cutting the back corner, the inside line is heavy with rocks, this also makes people turn left on the ice to take that outside line, most important. - Heavy patch at exit of back corner center of track to entice people to go near the rocks or take a sharp inside line. Losing all tyres in one hit is harsh, and possible in any of the heavy rock sections if not taken right, or avoided (or could become a fun thing to knock people into my driving is crazy and eratic at best, Ill be suffering more than most lol) Two lap races, 2 lap deathraces perhaps? A tone down of the damage? Placing though is important.
Smooth it out, with their road grading equipment perhaps,.... saw one of these at morgan gates, its hiding out back in the fog. (this here is the reason I think all tracks should look like the wunz I dun.)
 It really is meant to be a veterans track. You iz verteran right?
I do think its a fair concern, and greatly appreciate the feedback, just thought Id add my thoughts as to why It is how it is.
Ive been worried about this and if things may be needed. The loop is too long I fear, and there will not be enough smashy-smashy at the crossover. Damn fun to race it though, and Im glad theres lots of room to move o that ice
I love the thick fog, I find it great for surprise, you think you are further from the enemy than you are much of the time I find, its a bit scary. But, it is a lovely map, be nice to see it, and that would help people know where all the roads are. The idea to have a 2nd gates map, with different fog and snow settings? |
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*Bastille* Posted May 22, 2012, 1:51 pm |
Alan sticks his feet up on the bar...
Ain't got no problem with the track meself, just need to take a good look at where them rocks are. Morgan Speed Track event ID 193401 |
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Fifth Posted May 22, 2012, 6:22 pm |
Incorrect. Median is calculated exactly that way - line up all the data points from lowest to highest, and find the value that's smack in the middle.
Mean is when you dump all the data points in a pot and divide by the number of data points. A lot of people get those two mixed up. A median is considered much less vulnerable to extremes like those never-to-be-sufficiently-damned bankers. And the median household income in the United States is $44,389US, as of 2005. Source:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Household_income_in_the_United_States Their source, Census Bureau data from 2005. I'd bet that it's a little lower now, but I doubt it's dropped under the $40K mark. That's the national median, which is misleasing as all hell, because it assumes the United States is homogeneous, which it ain't. Local areas can vary widely. My county (Los Angeles County, California) is a fair bit above the average, at $55,000. But California's state average is up at $60,000. http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/06/06037.html Wait a second. Los Angeles has all those rich movie stars and celebrities and bankers, right? How can LA County have a lower median than the entire state? Because medians are *much* less vulnerable to a few outliers. What pulls LA County's median down is a very large population of people who aren't very affluent - lots and lots of ordinary joes. Conversely, what pulls California's median all the way up? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Clara_County,_California Santa Clara County. AKA Silicon Valley, with a median household income of $85K, almost twice the national median. What pulls Santa Clara's median up isn't a few billionaires, but a whole lot of fairly wealthy professionals - tech geeks forging the future, and other professionals like doctors and lawyers who provide services to them and their companies. There's an enormous regional variation. Bastille, as a fellow member of the 99%, your numbers are a little off. The 99th percentile (ie the line between the 99% and the 1%) is a bit above $250K in the United States. There's a lot of people living in poverty, especially in low-income areas of the country. But there's a lot of people in the 99% who are living fairly comfortable (if financially insecure) lives. They'll be okay as long as nothing goes wrong. The progressive movement will make very little progress unless we get our numbers right, buddy. (Just read over that and realized I have no idea if you're American, Bast, I just assumed you are for purposes of fact-checking your numbers. Whoops.) (Especially when firing a mortar at the bankers - you REALLY want to have your numbers right!) (Note to NSA and FBI: That last line was a joke. Really.) This is your Statistics Lesson of the Day. Now I'll go back to completely ignoring the debate on the Morgan Rules.
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Fifth Posted May 22, 2012, 6:27 pm |
Thanks! This looks really useful! (Though a Snorkel would be even more useful, hint hint.) |
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*DoubleTap* Posted May 22, 2012, 7:15 pm |
Keeping in mind that we can all make stats say whatever the heck we want (which, in the end, is the beautiful thing about stats,) here're some quick hits according to the US Census Bureau: Median household income 2006-2010 $51,914 Persons below poverty level, percent, 2006-2010 13.8% This data, of course, includes 2008, when it all went to hell in a handbasket. |
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*Bastille* Posted May 23, 2012, 1:20 am |
I was guessing, and I recon pretty close for a guess based on our rough average. Im aussie, and theres many different figures floating about in our media for what people earn. Planet America (TV show about US stuff, here in OZ) had some figures on earnings, Im just very loosely referring to some of those. About as trusty source of information as those demotivational pictures, or the liberal party. One in the same really. Entertaining show (any aussies here watching question time recently now that jenkins is gone? The new gal is even better than slipper. actually, he was pretty cool. Stuff Neighbours, I watch Question time in the Australian House of Representatives... thats my soapy fix for the day) |
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Lord Foul Posted May 23, 2012, 5:14 am |
Not a biggy to me if you keep it the way it is, just wanted to give my views/suggestions. I'll adapt as needed. As for smoothing it out, human/mutant muscle and some tools could go a long way. Did they move all those 1 ton cement dividers/markers on your tracks with pixie dust?
They can build, weld and repair cars from a frame up, but can't figure out how to make a large batch of cement/tar to smooth out some rough spots on a track?
See ya on the tracks, with or without tyres.
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*Bastille* Posted May 23, 2012, 6:45 am |
thats probably true about mutant muscle
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Lord Foul Posted May 28, 2012, 3:30 am |
More observations/comments on new maps
Had my first scout on the swamps of Dagon, or should I say the pea soup map. Looks to be a clone of the toxic map, but you can't see anything beyond 100m. Wish I could say I enjoyed the map, but I simply could not see much of anything and it's difficult to move around on this map, more so than the toxic map. 464296 1-The AI can not handle this map at all. If you make a map very difficult for a player to move around on, the AI is going to get completely confused or lost on it. Once the scout started I'd estimate the AI took at least 15 minutes trying to figure out where to go. It was almost like the pea soup visibility kept them from seeing me. Unless there's a legitimate reason to make it so the player can't see beyond 100m, like fog of war but with red text, visibility should be better on these maps. Once the AI figured out a path to reach me it started to look better for the AI. You'd get to witness an amazing maelstrom mess with me even under heavy fire from me, but that's another story. Later on I decided to leave/run as even bringing as much ammo as I could, it would probably not be enough to demo all of them. While running away the AI started having trouble dealing with the difficult terrain and became confused again. 2-If you do insist on going with the pea soup/poor visibility trend beyond 100m, I'd suggest a large penalty to hit with weapons beyond this range. The maelstrom was hitting me quite well at a range I could not even see him. Though I'd prefer to see my enemy, not some red text beyond 100m. 3-I went out 25 miles towards GW with 329 CR(2 cars). My scout was in a vampire and against a 127 famed gang, I pulled 823 CR(5 cars), 1.5 times the CR. Seems like a lot of extra CR, but could be just me. Usually only see that at gates of shanty going out 5 miles. Maybe just a bad roll. I do understand these are veteran maps, but if you make them so challenging that they are not enjoyable to play on, I can understand why players may not want to go to Morgan to defend it or scout on the maps. Just my 2 cents. |
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*Splash* Posted May 28, 2012, 4:03 am |
I was there for a week, but my only car got stolen over the weekend because of a failed camp defense. After all the trouble getting it out there, I'm not in a huge hurry to go back and lose more stuff.
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*Bastille* Posted May 28, 2012, 4:38 am |
A very valued 2 cents LF. I have not had the time (or also, needed time looking at something else than DW maps for a few days so I have not really tested these fully.
To point out, they are totally different map layouts. Toxic is a series of 4 dunes running endlessly across the path, a very narrow path slightly worn into the dunes. The water levels may have receded here. On S.O.D(hehe), The fog level seems to be stronger in the real game than the builder, the visibility is better there (see pics in other thread), you can see quite a way. This was more how it was intended I guess; the fog blended in nicely with the slow moving clouds, made the fog seem to move a little which I though was cool {the never ending story was actually my model for this when the horsey drowns}, but its not happening in the live game(couldn't find a horse). Pirate Canyon is also 'thicker' than I thought it would be, the aurora is not at all visible until you get to 2000meters high (above the black fog, Ive only had one encounter here, and I could at least see a good 2-300m ok) Swamps, (only had one encounter so far on swamps, I'll try send out some scouts today and have a good perv) was very hard for me to find the track, and I put it there(this goes for morgan gates too). Its a crossroad map, the gallows being on the center mound in the swamp. There are then 4 roads leaving this spot (the intersection is offset a bit, check this center mound for a reference point) over the larger mounds protruding from the shallows. Look for spots in the swamps with more reflections on the water surface, those sections are deeper. The fog is thicker than it was meant to be, I'll play with that today too (hoping I can get that effect of cloud meets fog, looks really cool in the builder. I don't want to trial and error it too much though, be a pita for sam, so I might just dial it back a lot.
I'll also go post some pics, point out some of the roads, theres a nice few little ped shootout spots here too I thought. Thinking that may be popular on these roads. AI not handling the terrain, Not sure whats going on there, maybe just take soem time to learn the area, not many people there yet, and I guess the trying to avoid water (they seem to handle it quite well in most places, The pits, they like driving there more than on the road ) or maybe something is wrong with my pathing. <-----quite likely
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*Bastille* Posted May 28, 2012, 6:16 am |
You think you got bad odds S464328 Gallow blew up my ammo unfortunately.
Watching your replay, the AI seem to do ok |
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*Tinker* Posted May 28, 2012, 8:58 pm |
Lol they stole my v8 engine out of my car? Don't remember maybe i had it out getting fixed?
Anyone know how to find out how many defense events we lost this weekend? |
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*Bastille* Posted May 29, 2012, 1:29 am |
yeah, some note somewhere like the tavern would be really good. A note in the activities tab? Im checking my cars and lockup after each.
Should we ask how this plan for Morgan is working? Hows everyone feel about it. I've read some thoughts here and there Is the CR balance too high for the types of cars players wish to use here? Muscle was all the talk when coming to Morgan, I feel much safer defending in my.. defender (mines a defender, freelanders suck balls)
This idea is too encourage PvE and risky, carefree play (you win some here, you lose some, you get stuff, you lose it, nice little skill bonus for cappers too.) 3 encounters over the weekend (end of month raids I see them as) so even if you win the event you have time for, you need to rely on others to win in their time zones or you may lose some stuff. Being on the weekend, seems a good number can turn up to play at least one, if not two events. Some have brought up point about not being able to turn up to events. Is this currently a good schedule, could things change in anyway? is 3 attacks a good number, could one be during the week for other players? Is the CR right for the sort of scouting here? Are penalties enough or too much, do they feel right? Any other concerns, bits you like strongly? I have one concern, I fear Grograt is at risk of getting very ill as he is not getting enough vitamin DW. Please poke fun at him until he returns. |
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Lord Foul Posted May 29, 2012, 1:40 am |
Hopefully you can dial it in better so it's not as frustrating to deal with. Don't get me wrong, adding "some" fog to spice things up a bit can be a good thing, but if you spend more time zooming in and out trying to figure out where and what the AI is doing, it becomes more of an annoying chore than a challenging scout. And while you are zooming in and out from the AI, if you are moving at the same time trying to avoid white water blobs of deep crevasses on slippery rocks, you can start to see where it can get frustrating. I actually like your pirate canyon map "darkness" fog, it works well to convey fighting at nighttime, which is a rarity in DW. While I could not get a good look at the pirate canyon map, it appeared barren compared to your other nice looking maps. All I could find was the buried van and two arrow signs, was there any other objects on this map? I believe it would be good to see more maps using your fog of darkness to simulate night fighting. |
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*Bastille* Posted May 29, 2012, 2:00 am |
Yeah, this is important. As much as this is the exact challenge I wanted to put forward, and also play with the idea of fog of war, being too much of a pita that you rather not fight there... thats not too good. Once you know the map its different, but while you are looking for where to go its hard to make a plan. I wanted to do this last night, started making the vault instead If I use same settings as toxic, that should work ok for it. It really would be nice to see here.
Morgan Gates I really like the fog, makes it very challenging, having the alt clear version would be good for that too so people can learn the map and see it. Its a beautiful map, lots of trees.
Im was hoping people would like this. I really like the idea of maps having a similar setting (or maybe similar to Morgan Lake Speed Track) as a second version of the map. So you can fight night and day time at the same location. Maybe sun/moon in different position to cast different shadows.
Theres a few things to see around Pirate Canyon (theres some spoiler pics in here) Half the map is kinda open, half kinda closed in. Judging from early Morgan trader reports, theres some tight sections through a canyon, a few shipments were lost to ambushes there. The report also talks about a possible pirate camp, and I guess thats where the name comes from. |
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Joel Autobaun Posted May 29, 2012, 6:13 am |
I had only one car in town and they stole it, my ganger is stranded and pissed , can he beat on the town residents? |
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*Tinker* Posted May 29, 2012, 8:02 am |
to answer that we need to know how badly we failed this time. the first weekend we lost 1 out of 3, and i didn't loose anything (not sure if i had anything in lockup though) |
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*Bastille* Posted May 29, 2012, 10:07 am |
I lost a bucc, pickup, some weapons, and all the RL ammo I had. No point stock piling that ammo
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Juris Posted May 29, 2012, 2:25 pm |
Agree with Tink that it would be good to know more about why the defense failed the second time. But...
I think what it really boils down to is a numbers problem - small player base of people with guys and cars in Morgan combined with three encounters on set times that not everyone can make. |
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JS Posted May 29, 2012, 4:19 pm |
I think it's a bit more than that. It's a cost/benefit problem. The possibility of some training bonus and getting training over a cap is intrigueing, but it is not compelling enough. Add to that high CR odds, poor loot/low relative fame gangs and there is not much incentive. I get the teamwork aspect, and new maps and the shot at making the training desireable but I really think it doesn't add up to lots of people trying it out. Just two cents, and I hope I'm wrong and it works out well. But as of now I doubt it. |
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Lord Foul Posted May 30, 2012, 5:37 am |
I hope so too, It would be good to see how much of a skill gain you get from a successful defense, because if it's not better than SS, many players will simply stay in SS to safely gain their skill each week. SS can be good and bad for the game at the same time. I want to attend the morgan defenses, but my schedule has not allowed me to attend any at this time. I did suggest to Sam that he fluctuate the times to gauge the best turnouts and/or find the best time to set it perm. once we had a good idea of when the most players will show. While it's a pain in the arse to get to Morgan(Thanks Bast.) I believe the reward is worth it even if I lose some equipment. If the bonus is actually good, I don't mind losing some stuff as it can be replaced with a run from BL. And unless your character is in bad shape losing skill from age/wounds, the skill you gain can't be lost/taken like equipment. Multiply the skill gain by 5 characters each week and it can quickly add up if you put some time into it. |
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Joel Autobaun Posted May 30, 2012, 3:48 pm |
Bah after reading that - it sounds like a good place for hard core, playing all the time vets to get further "ahead" faster and easier. Hogwash I say. |
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Blaer Posted May 30, 2012, 5:16 pm |
Lol... Who caps skill... Don't you have to live forever to do that? | ||||||||
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*Bastille* Posted May 31, 2012, 2:06 am |
Ive got 3 cappers there now, and yes they seem to be gaining skill fast* But they are capped in most things, there is a limit to the numbers I can have in town, scouting there is not going to gain me much skill boost. The loses every week leave me to believe there is no point hoarding stuff here, and its a bit of a struggle to stay. I faced 1500CR to my 223CR the other day, nuts hard opposition. People think my maps are way to hard (I love them Morgan town = Bastille town, the rest of you are too soft, buzz off. There, that should get some of you in). The boosts are a small incentive as I see it, theres many cons too, the main thing that seems inviting to me is the new area and new motive for town defense. Been a long time since I looked at those events in other towns, I might start doing so again.
Some town events would spice this place up some maybe? We need some names of crazed, deranged, ultra-violent hockey teams. *(one had deteriorated to 10> off his skill caps, for about the 5th time, hes old. So he gained back to those quickly with the skill boost. None of them have gained passed their caps yet, But they are all old, decrepit people) |
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Bishop robbiec40@msn.com Posted Jun 2, 2012, 6:42 am |
omw to help | ||||||||
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*goat starer* Posted Jun 2, 2012, 2:06 pm |
i think we know how that feels |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 2, 2012, 2:15 pm |
you bunch of youngen pups, not yet of this world....
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted Jun 3, 2012, 9:26 pm |
Well how 'bout that. I lost a V8 Windsor2 and a Phoenix, both well-equipped. For some reason I thought we had to defend Morgan on a monthly basis instead of weekly.
Heh. That went poorly. |
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*Tinker* Posted Jun 3, 2012, 10:39 pm |
wondering who could show up to defend morgan this weekend | ||||||||
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 4, 2012, 12:46 am |
maybe, if I have any cars left. I missed defense 3 this week due to forgetting to repair my Defender. ( I can never make 2) | ||||||||
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Lord Foul Posted Jun 4, 2012, 1:30 am |
I'm going to try my best to show up for the 3rd/last one next week. If a few others could show for event 1 and 2, we can hopefully move things in the right direction.
I understand it's the beginning of summer and people play less, but all it takes is a small handful of players to give everyone there a nice bonus. Did anyone show for this weekends events? |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 4, 2012, 1:44 am |
I showed for one. Normally show for at least one or two (ahh 3).
Clint 'Eastwood' Smith got about 10 points training from 2 fights. Not bad at all. |
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*Wolfsbane* Posted Jun 4, 2012, 8:28 am |
Could I get a confirmation of what the bulk limits are on the Morgan roads? I tried sending a TT to test, but there didn't seem to be any warning short of pressing the travel button, which I'm obviously reluctant to do
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Tez Posted Jun 4, 2012, 8:32 am |
I've been told the bulk limit is the same what the Elm to GW bulk limit used to be, so 300. Lost a pickup & my v8 Windsor cause either the second or third defense was lost, sending more hardware down there. | ||||||||
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Juris Posted Jun 4, 2012, 2:15 pm |
Bulk limit 300
0 for 3 on Morgan defense. What happened this week? |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 4, 2012, 11:03 pm |
no, first one was won. | ||||||||
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted Jun 4, 2012, 11:38 pm |
Yeah, we definatly smeared the snow in raider blood on the first defense.
One oddity... I have attended 3 defenses, 2 were wins and 1 was an auto truce glitch that has been fixed... But im now "Notorious and ADORED" in Morgan. How can I only fight a couple times (and only once effectvely, though in all cases courageously) and already be adored? I fight my butt off other places and become appreciated. Seems a bit excessive to gain that much for so little |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 7, 2012, 8:10 am |
Im thinking there could be good reason for this, but I could only speculate, so I won't
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 10, 2012, 12:43 am |
Sitting at cap now for a few weeks, using my characters there regularly. No gains above cap as of yet. | ||||||||
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Lord Foul Posted Jun 10, 2012, 2:56 am |
Pretty sure you'll need the bonus to be active to go above cap. Unfortunately some events are not attended or lost. Look like today's was lost at least once, just lose 2 cars I brought there and one arrived less than a day ago.bummer. |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 10, 2012, 3:18 am |
Ive been in at least 1 if not 2 each week with the same characters, lost my first one last night. So I would expect to see some gains by now judging by the descriptions of the mechanism for this. | ||||||||
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Lord Foul Posted Jun 10, 2012, 4:09 am |
We just mopped the floor with them.
Thanks to those who keep at it each week.
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted Jun 10, 2012, 6:07 am |
Question to those who have lost cars: When you lost the car to theft, did you have an empty lockup?
So far my lockups have been raided each week but have been lucky enough not to lose cars. Week 1 I lost 3 or 4 engines. Week 2 I lost a weapon and a couple engines Week 3 I lost a half dozen tires, ammo and some engines This week I lost an engine or two and an MMG Just wondering if my tactic of keeping a lockup full of "steal me" buffers is actually protecting my assets or if it's just been luck so far. |
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*Maxxed* Posted Jun 10, 2012, 8:53 am |
This sounds like an excellent idea...and would really give players something to fight for...if one player driven faction dominated then the NPC attacks could become greater and greater in number until overwhelming and the control of the town would shift again it would be nice to see factions playing a bigger role in the game especially in the sense of PvE and PvP... On the subject of factions...I often wondered if PvP could be wired into it somehow...perhaps you dont have to be a member of a faction...but if you are a member of a faction u have to pvp againt enemies of that faction or some such) |
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Djihani Posted Jun 10, 2012, 7:28 pm |
Bugger, lost my buccy to them thieves... gotta setup some travel phoenixes without the 5l engines in future. Never putting rare gear there again lol
Still got 3 std tyres in lockup, lost fuel and a tyre and a paint gun or something... |
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*Snipe* Posted Jun 10, 2012, 7:54 pm |
{{knocking on wood as I post this}}
So far after having been thru 3 weeks in Morgan and taking part in 2 failed defenses - I have yet to lose anything there that wasnt shot out from under me. |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 10, 2012, 9:54 pm |
I say we go raid the Renshai Lockup!
Ive lost.. lots.. and lots
They have not taken my Chulain with no motor, but they took the v8 I had in the shed that was waiting on repair. |
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Juris Posted Jun 11, 2012, 7:39 pm |
So... Morgan got sacked again - isn't that 0 for 4?
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Serephe Posted Jun 11, 2012, 7:44 pm |
2/3 fights were won though, and it would have been 3/3 if them Ravanged Scavengers or whatever hadn't turned back to fight too soon!
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*StCrispin* ce.services.mh@gmail.com Posted Jun 12, 2012, 1:08 am |
Or if my losers hadnt gotten blasted through the air and turtled.
Thats the first morgan fight, including scouts, where I lost anything. Too bad one of the missing items this week is a rather attractive leg. Nikki Bunny, the hot ski bunny, wants it back if found. No using it for your less-than-reputable uses. Last seen about a mile and a half south of town, flying through the air after a rocket strike blew it off while she fired crossbow bolts at that pesky scorp... |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 12, 2012, 2:13 am |
Yeah, talk about confidence issues.... "Yeah sure, Ill take on 4-5 times my firepower in a dogfight in the snow!" :/ Especially when I could out range them (is that even a term?!?) 2-1 If the inventor of this madness would actually turn up.... I call Foul!
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Lord Foul Posted Jun 12, 2012, 4:06 am |
Was that intended at me Bast? hard to tell.lol One thing to keep in mind, which Ser noticed right away this Sat. is that someone needs to bring a good scout. I did on the last event this past Sat. and the NPCs spawned at a good distance from us. This gave us some time to plan a defense and pick our spots to face the NPCs. It also allowed us to split the main NPC group apart so each of us did not have massive firepower concentrated in one area. Ser circled around and picked a few off while another group came at me and Dolce. When I viewed other morgan defenses, it appears that players are not bringing a good scout and the AI is spawning with headons or very close to the players. Plus as you know, there's a good chance more CR will spawn against you when you don't have a good scout in the event. If you want to lesson the pain and increase you odds of winning the event, get a scout in there.
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 12, 2012, 4:14 am |
That was the intention, all tongue in cheek of course dude
Scout is a good idea... Ive been using a 5 sct No one else fits in the car with 10 reloads... I've needed them all.
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 12, 2012, 5:06 am |
more 6 from 12 (or something like that) each event is taken on its own merit, I believe. I definitely lose something after each loss, not each weekend. |
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*Wolfsbane* Posted Jun 12, 2012, 5:18 am |
I have a 170 scout in Morgan. Unfortunately he learned how deep the water is around there the hard way, but I should be able to loot something he can drive by next week
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*sam* Posted Jun 12, 2012, 4:04 pm |
The players need to win all three combats to get training boosts that week |
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted Jun 12, 2012, 4:11 pm |
That's how I thought it worked. We are so screwed.
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Tez Posted Jun 12, 2012, 5:10 pm |
We've been screwed since it opened, we barely won the first town defence, it was one of my peds & a pair of heavies left concious at the end I think. | ||||||||
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*sam* Posted Jun 12, 2012, 5:22 pm |
What needs changing: the odds, the number of combats, and/or the timing of the combats? | ||||||||
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FireFly Posted Jun 12, 2012, 5:34 pm |
The availability of participants, for example... I keep forgetting about it
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Tez Posted Jun 12, 2012, 5:58 pm |
The availability of basic hardware at the shop, some more 2L's & MG's would be nice, enough to make a scoutable car. The odds are great, I love how it's really hard. | ||||||||
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Juris Posted Jun 12, 2012, 6:05 pm |
+1 Yep I'll say it again - make Morgan defense like a camp attack - maybe require 2+ players to participate, and have the three town attacks happen during the week (with the same advanced notice). That way people can defend Morgan on their time. The downside to this would be if the same team did all three defenses, which would be kinda lame but people probably wouldn't do that if you asked them not to. |
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted Jun 12, 2012, 6:23 pm |
For me the problem is not really seeing a benefit equal to the dangers. I got a couple of nice cars down there early, wasnt able to make any of the defenses, and lost all.
It looks to be hell for the casual player. I'm trying to come up with a justification for returning to Morgan, but can't come up with much beyond "try to help your fellow man." That went out of fashion long before the solar apocalypse, didn't it?
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*Wolfsbane* Posted Jun 12, 2012, 6:24 pm |
sam - check out the post about google calendar in the suggestions forum. That might be enough, if it's as easy to implement as I suspect it is. |
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*Splash* Posted Jun 12, 2012, 6:36 pm |
LMAO! Sadly, you are correct... |
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Juris Posted Jun 12, 2012, 7:02 pm |
Lol - What about adoring ski bunnies? Maybe successful town defenders can't get their stuff stolen that week? That way you're not punished if some other goofball drops the ball. |
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Serephe Posted Jun 12, 2012, 9:57 pm |
There was a scout along for the second defense, which was a close spawn; he ended up dead. It helps, sure, but it's not foolproof. All events are winnable though it just depends how much effort the players are willing to go through. | ||||||||
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted Jun 12, 2012, 10:05 pm |
Maybe a sliding scale instead of all or nothing?
--Win one defense: In-town losses reduced to vehicle damage and/or moderate personal injury. --Win two defenses: Break-even. No damage/injury, but no bonus beyond what was gained in combat. --Win three defenses: The "Morgan Training Bonus" is earned, including progress beyond cap. --Oh, and of course if we lose all three we see the standard horrifying injuries and vehicle theft we're experiencing now. This way the whole town suffers or gains based on player actions, but we're not decimated week after week. [EDIT] Additionally, at the two- and three-win levels we could see slight to moderately increased availability of equipment from npcs (motors, weapons) as they weren't looted by the baddies. |
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Serephe Posted Jun 12, 2012, 11:08 pm |
Make it benefit the people actually willing to stick their necks out; if you participate in a defense, your stuff won't be stolen, besides anything lost in the events. If you win a town defense, you get a x% of the training bonus, even if others drop the ball in theirs. | ||||||||
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 13, 2012, 12:44 am |
+1 to that
and maybe some NPCs race teams for the track events, give people something else to do. |
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Lord Foul Posted Jun 13, 2012, 4:53 am |
Guess many have forgotten, you already get a training bonus if you participate in town defenses. It's the same bonus you'd get for the SS defenses(that few even play) If you do a morgan defense, after the event look at your characters used and see how much their used skills go up. From one morgan defense you can gain a weeks worth of skill in multiple skills, depending on how many were used in the battle. All 3 of my guys went up 1-3 points in multiple skills used just from that one event. Think of how many skill points you'd get per week if the same players showed up to all the defenses, won all three and then got the morgan training bonus. You could possibly attain double digit increases in multiple skills per week. Ser, take a look at your guys that were in Sat. events, you'll see what I mean. |
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Serephe Posted Jun 13, 2012, 5:12 am |
I took part in all 3 defenses, and my skills only went up the same as if I'd done 3 regular scouts; I was more talking about the Morgan bonus training, rather than bonus training in the event, anyway. Because in the end, that's what players are fighting for(as well as making sure their cars don't get stolen). | ||||||||
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Lord Foul Posted Jun 13, 2012, 5:26 am |
You're saying you used the same guys in all 3 events and and gained just a few points? Here's an example of one of my guys from that event. He's in bad shape near his death from drug addictions. All the skill gained below is from that one event. Skills & Abilities Strength 25 Dexterity 1 Speed 24 Leadership -10 Courage 82 (81) Gunnery 135 (132) Large Guns 82 Ballistics 85 Hand Guns 83 Mechanic 45 (41) In my scouts, I'll get usually get 1 point in mech/gunner etc.. or maybe 2 on a good day per scout. Never 3 or 4 from one event. I've only seen these types of increases in the SS defenses. Please show me your guys that you used that only gained skill you would normally get in 3 regular scouts. |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 13, 2012, 5:44 am |
I had forgotten about the regular bonuses. That may well be what I was seeing before, gaining a good few points in many skills after only a few events.
The casual player should really be taking part in as many of these as they can over normal events. The only way we can meat the likes of Serephe, 80s and the big gun... JS
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Serephe Posted Jun 13, 2012, 6:22 am |
Second look at them, the mech, leadership and courage all went up more than I'd expect; I imagine the gun skills I'm used to seeing are just from firing more shots, landing more hits, than what I did in the morgan defenses. My driver only gained 3 points of gunnery, and my gunner only gained 8. Same guys for all 3 events. I'm used to gaining 2-3 points per, up to 5 per, depending on how and where I'm scouting.
Also, these guys were used in a group scout the day before, possibly after training, as I don't remember using handguns in any of the defenses. Metzler Strength 50 Dexterity 59 Speed 68 Leadership 65 (52) Courage 84 (75) Driving 39 (38) Cyclist 20 (20) Gunnery 34 (26) Large Guns 21 (20) Hand Guns 71 (69) Scouting 40 (38) Nameless garbage driver Strength 24 Dexterity 33 Speed 79 Leadership 21 Courage 94 (87) Driving 21 (17) Gunnery 11 (8) Mechanic 15 (5) Looking at just gunnery training is what caught me out, since I'm used to that being the fastest to train; the others have gained really good though, especially the mech gaining 10 points from the 2 successes, the courage going up 9 points each, and gaining 2 points of scouting (though that may be weekly training, not sure what Metzler is training right now). That's a real big incentive to show up to the defenses, IF they are succesful. We lost several hall of famers this week. That's a big loss compared to the gains you can get from the training. |
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JS Posted Jun 13, 2012, 11:46 am |
Sere, none of that is really very amazing considering the low skill of your guys, the amount of clips you probably went through and the location o fyoru three events. Even the mech training is not that amazing, very similar to BL/Shanty really. | ||||||||
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Serephe Posted Jun 13, 2012, 12:40 pm |
In case ya didn't notice, I'm for adding incentive to fight, I never said it was amazing. Foul asked me, I posted. | ||||||||
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*sam* Posted Jun 14, 2012, 8:59 am |
Yeah, in most cases it's not a good idea to expect people to play to an external schedule.
Would this work?: - from the squad page, after you have added your vehicle to the squad, you can launch the combat immediately - but only if there are least 3 player cars in the squad - it will have to be clearly explained on the signup page, so that people don't add their cars and then go away expecting the combat to happen at the originally stated time |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 14, 2012, 1:16 pm |
I think that could work quite well.
Juris for RC ;-) |
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Serephe Posted Jun 14, 2012, 2:51 pm |
What's to stop certain people from just starting them all with some friends and purposely losing them then? Even if folks didn't do that, I'd hate to miss out on one of the defenses because it was done between the time it came available and the time I get out of bed. | ||||||||
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*sam* Posted Jun 14, 2012, 2:53 pm |
It's a tough one for sure, Sere. I'm open to other suggestions! | ||||||||
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Serephe Posted Jun 14, 2012, 3:05 pm |
I still think you should make it so that if you take part in one of the defenses, your cars are protected from being stolen that week (even if you lose) and if you win an event, you get part of the training bonus even if one of the other events is lost.
If it's not the incentive to play, but rather the times they're set at, then just spread the events through the week at peak playtimes. Some euro, some US, and if there's enough of us oceanics besides me and Bastille, then some for us too. Personally I'm quite happy to take my junkers out and defend the town whenever I'm available even with things as they are now though, and I'd hate to see any changes be a backwards step. |
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Juris Posted Jun 14, 2012, 4:24 pm |
I think that's a good idea As to what Sere said - that would be lame if the same team did all three combats - but I think the people who play this game are cool enough not to do that. |
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*sam* Posted Jun 14, 2012, 5:51 pm |
It would be nice to have a benefit that was enforced socially rather than by game rules, if you get me. Maybe it's not possible in practice... | ||||||||
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*Tinker* Posted Jun 14, 2012, 8:57 pm |
if there was 3 different player cars in the squad wouldn't that work? | ||||||||
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Serephe Posted Jun 15, 2012, 12:32 am |
There's always going to be people who will try to ruin the enjoyment of others, and without open PvP there's no way for the community to retaliate against those people. | ||||||||
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*Rev. V* Posted Jun 15, 2012, 4:54 am |
Morgan Issues-
1- The golf carts models don't work anymore. 2- Where the hell did my marshal issued squadcar go? Are any other marshals having problems with this? 3- The brothel code is broken, all it does now is take your money, the cutscenes don't show anymore. |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 16, 2012, 12:11 am |
My squadcars work fine... goto Marshals vehicle list
Did you see all the new weapons? Heavy Gatling Lasers and Missile Launchers are awesome. 500m,.. what!? They don't know whats coming. |
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*Jagged Monkey* Posted Jun 16, 2012, 11:29 am |
What no tac nukes? | ||||||||
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 16, 2012, 3:27 pm |
oh.. no mythical weapons. Admittedly, HGL are pretty heavy, and lots of bulk... 100 | ||||||||
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*Splash* Posted Jun 16, 2012, 5:13 pm |
back on topic (sort of): Did anyone bother to defend Morgan in the first fight this weekend? | ||||||||
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*Wolfsbane* Posted Jun 16, 2012, 5:15 pm |
Someone did, because the event was running when I checked an hour later. No idea how it went. | ||||||||
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*goat starer* Posted Jun 16, 2012, 6:19 pm |
i have the marshal issue squad car and i am keeping it |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 17, 2012, 12:22 am |
I thought you had to return those. Cool!
They may just run for a while. I think they are often running even if there is no one there. |
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*Rev. V* Posted Jun 17, 2012, 7:16 am |
I spectated the last one, the snow effect was a nice surprise!!!!!
Wanted to help, but I had no one there. 
Sere and company had it well in hand for that incursion. A Buccy is on it's way though!
I'll help when I can once it gets there! |
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*Splash* Posted Jun 17, 2012, 5:02 pm |
We took care of the third one this week pretty easily.
Rev, I really hate the falling snowflakes; it shouldn't take me most of my turn to try to locate my cursor so I can actully play the game with the remaining few seconds. It would also be nice if we knew how the other two events went; any way to do this, short of loading and watching them? |
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Serephe Posted Jun 17, 2012, 10:05 pm |
Second one went fine, 1st and 3rd I wasn't able to attend this week sadly; next week I should be able to do all 3 again. | ||||||||
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*Rev. V* Posted Jun 18, 2012, 2:40 pm |
Got jumped, lost the Buccy, but the ganger survived the wolves on the walk.....
Guess I'll buy something once I get there! |
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Juris Posted Jun 19, 2012, 5:15 pm |
Morgan is now 0 for 5 right? | ||||||||
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Serephe Posted Jun 19, 2012, 10:17 pm |
Think so; the first one might not have had anyone show up, since I wasn't able to make it this week and Bastille hasn't been on. Next weeks should go better. | ||||||||
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted Jun 20, 2012, 1:52 am |
I recommend the 2L Sunrise for $200k.
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*Rev. V* Posted Jun 20, 2012, 4:37 am |
200k?!?!?!?
I recommend you suck on........ a nice delicious cold drink.....
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Tez Posted Jun 20, 2012, 7:46 am |
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted Jun 20, 2012, 2:10 pm |
I bought the pickup yesterday and while it wasn't cheap, it was fair given vehicle availability in Morgan.
But now all that's left is the price-gouge-a-rama from the Dolly Cabana boys: Sunrise: 165k Apache: 200k etc. Sorry Rev, got my price tags mixed up. At $165k the Sunrise is merely highway robbery. |
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*sam* Posted Jun 20, 2012, 3:36 pm |
I'm thinking Morgan prices will peak early each week, when your stuff isn't liable to getting stolen out from under you? | ||||||||
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 22, 2012, 9:08 am |
bah, steady and accessible prices for the people... equality!
{Moved the other stuff on vehicles etc. to Morgan RP thread - Morgan Defenders - By *Bastille* the socialist Ba$tard }
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Stingray191 Posted Jun 22, 2012, 10:33 am |
So, is it worth my while to ship decent stuff to Morgan to sell, knowing it could vanish before it's sold?
*Disclaimer* I have no interest in being in Morgan to actually win these fights as it's too much a PITA at my current level of involvement. But am looking for easy money car sales. |
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*Snipe* Posted Jun 22, 2012, 11:20 pm |
Well Sting, sounds like one of them risk vs. reward type things. You can constantly make more per chassis here - even when prices level out. But you will be dependent on others to be able to defend your stocks. Sounds like a good thing for any level of involvement. You can make good money, and that in turn strengthens the defenders thus making it easier to defend and keep things safe. So the more support at any level by the masses - the better the chances. I like the fact that there is a town that is like this now. Not forced cooperation, but a step right below. Now lets see if the community can band together and make it work. Then we can all make up our minds if it is worth it or not. |
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Serephe Posted Jun 23, 2012, 12:35 am |
Except that it is still easier to sell cars for more in SS with no risk of losing them before they sell. | ||||||||
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*Snipe* Posted Jun 23, 2012, 1:13 am |
You know what? For how many gangs out there that have been around for a while and even most of the new ones - I have a thing to point out. For how easy this game can get to be - it is only as easy as you make it.
You want to sit in the kiddie pool (SS) with all your nerdy friends and trade your toys - then have at it. But for those with the balls to actually push your own limits and force yourself to think then maybe skipping out on "the easy way" every now and again will do you good. And no - I dont solo out of Shanty like some of you......I dont solo anywhere. But I am scout ready in every town and am willing to go out of any of them. But these same guys that are mass producing expensive stuff and mass soloing down south are the ones crying the most about "the safe and easy way". Which I understand that you have learned and used it to bring your gangs to what they are today. But the fact that the big vets are some of the most afraid to try something - -hold for effect-- "dangerous" it just shows me that just because your gangers have been kept well protected in their vaults while getting to shoot and level at their leisure dont mean as much to me as the newer players and mid players gangers that dont have the stats but have the heart. So - by all means- keep with the masses and grind out selling to the players in SS for your money. God knows it is easier. But I dont play this game like an accountant - - - I play it more like a drunken redneck. Let the fun begin - sissies can all stay home. |
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*Snipe* Posted Jun 23, 2012, 1:15 am |
And if you want to stick to the "easy way" then I need someone to babysit the kids while I am out causing another apocalypse. Reply to Dexters.... | ||||||||
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Sarge Posted Jun 23, 2012, 10:40 am |
Hey, can we make the pirates steal the most expensive vehicles in the market when they are gonna steal cars? I mean, if I were a pirate stealing cars I would take the ones with the highest ticket prices.
Maybe this would help engineer some co-op rather than the current attempts at scalping the market seems to be "offering". Seriously, the prices *some* people are charging for stuff there is insulting. Yeah people are free to mark up their wares at whatever price they want, but them pirates must be drooling... A $250k 4L Moray with a MG... Surely the boot is full of diamonds! |
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Tez Posted Jun 23, 2012, 11:29 am |
1st town defense won.
MORGAN HO!!!!!!!! |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 23, 2012, 3:56 pm |
:facepalm: this is game announcements people
try discussions, maybe the role play thread, how a bout a bagel? 
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 24, 2012, 1:06 am |
..and what snipe said
its up to you as to how much you do Theres nothing overly hard about Morgan. Evan a whipper snapper can field a car there and make a go at it. You lose stuff, you send out a taxi, pick up crew, make another car in GW or BL and send it back by the next day. At the worst, you get to drive the new maps and learn where best to fight on them/with them. |
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*Bastille* Posted Jun 24, 2012, 1:10 am |
You have to consider how much effort goes into nabbing this stuff.. HPs are easy to get, when you invest the time and effort into the stuff to go find them, if you use easier methods, kudos... this price is about right for what is meant to be a very rare item. If making stuff at camp, you are using many mechs, lots of equipment and time... prices are not so bad when you consider all these things.... this is the open market btw... privately you can pick up stuff like this for free from the right person, or using the right methods. SS is too easy to get rares as is.
Now, how about that discussions thread. |
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*Jagged Monkey* Posted Jun 24, 2012, 1:41 am |
Damn right man. You hit the nail on the head. I've been saying this for a long time. |
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Necrotech Posted Jun 24, 2012, 2:29 am |
Personally... if you make a successful defense event, you should be immune to to that weeks robberies.
AKA if you do your part, make an event and win it, let the losers take the heat on that. Myself and Splash make it a once week thing to go and do the do for those, and pulling our weight. Let those who lose or do not participate, get robbed. |
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*Rev. V* Posted Jul 23, 2012, 12:27 am |
OK, did all 3 defenses this weekend.
WE WON!!!! Had a BLAST! I have 2 things I'd like to mention- #1- The "forest" map is gorgeous. Too bad you can't SEE it. #2- I think a gang should NEVER be in a position where enough of their equipment gets stolen that they can't participate. As in, no matter what, you should always have one vehicle with engine and weapons. I like the challenge of playing Morgan defenses, but if I can't GET the challenge of playing Morgan defense, because all my stuff got ripped off and all I can do is watch the next scout? I'm gonna lose interest VERY quickly. Dunno if that can happen, but if it CAN, then that might need to be looked into. |
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Lord Foul Posted Jul 23, 2012, 12:52 am |
I previously mentioned these concerns in a private thread Sam has for Morgan, but I'm guessing Sam is busy working on other projects. I even mentioned that I do not believe the training bonus is working properly and needs a look. Hopefully these issues will be addressed before most lose interest, causing Morgan to fade into obscurity. |
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*Bastille* Posted Jul 23, 2012, 12:55 am |
For the training bonus to work, all 3 events had to be won, I believe. Interesting to see what happens after this week, the first I think, where all 3 events were successful for the defense.
Anyone have any cappers, training their cap, in town defense that week? |
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*Rev. V* Posted Jul 23, 2012, 3:16 am |
Hmmm...
I have a gal there capped at 105 in gunnery, I switched her back to train in gunnery just now.... We shall see what happens.
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Lord Foul Posted Jul 23, 2012, 4:01 am |
The training bonus was "on" for the week of June 23-29th Bast. . This will be the second time it was on after a successful defense.
I have an old cap'd character there and he did go up 1 point in his cap'd skill while the bonus was on for that week. |
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*sam* Posted Jul 23, 2012, 9:43 am |
There is a note on the town page: "The Morgan training boost is currently ON". This will switch to OFF if one or more of the defences in the current week have failed. |
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*Tinker* Posted Jul 23, 2012, 1:59 pm |
seems like the training boost is only useful for cappers? seems noobs wouldn't get any benefits here, i think.
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*sam* Posted Jul 23, 2012, 4:23 pm |
That was true up until today, when I made a change so that when the training boost is in effect in Morgan, everyone gets a temporary training form boost. So this benefits new characters as much as cappers. |
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*Rev. V* Posted Jul 27, 2012, 3:09 am |
Well, she went up to 106...
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*Wolfsbane* Posted Jul 27, 2012, 6:23 am |
Three of my four capped guys gained a point, so I'd say it's working. | ||||||||
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*Rev. V* Posted Aug 6, 2012, 11:24 am |
And my only vehicle there got stolen.
I'm done with Morgan. |
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*DoubleTap* Posted Aug 6, 2012, 3:46 pm |
Rev, I just read the HoF, and I think you might have a jealousy problem in the convent. |
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*Bastille* Posted Aug 6, 2012, 11:35 pm |
Their STDs are so bad you nickname them Napalm? | ||||||||
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*Rev. V* Posted Aug 7, 2012, 1:53 am |
Actually, the napalm is the CURE!!!!!
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Speed_Melon Posted Aug 26, 2012, 5:07 pm |
I keep reading this thread title "Moron Special Rules"
which is why I keep rereading it.
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Juris Posted Sep 25, 2012, 12:00 am |
So.... don't you think it's time to get rid of the Morgan 'special rules' - as predicted Morgan is such a PITA that no one goes there. I think Morgan has been sacked all but one time - and that was when people still tried to defend it.
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*Bastille* Posted Sep 25, 2012, 1:04 am |
Race teams!
Combat Teams! PED teams! |
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Philyn Posted Sep 26, 2012, 11:06 pm |
I never been to Morgan but got people on the way. I could set up a presence there but I just read this thread and forgot half of what is and what was.
My opinion is that you have "Morgan Fame" which can protect your goods (Gain by scouting) Training boost is tied to the Attacks(Not sure how to fix but have a few ideas) 1) I saw the idea of be able to start the attack with a gang(Good but not fair to people who don't fight) 2) Have attacks (14) times a week and must be in and win at least (3) of them. |
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Philyn Posted Sep 30, 2012, 2:14 pm |
Well I brought (2) cars in for the COE death rally. One came in yesterday and one this morning. I just looked and they are both gone. Well I am not coming back if your cars can disappear in a matter of a few hours.
Phi P.S. Looking for a ride to get (3) gangers back to the real world. |
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*SirLatte* Posted Sep 30, 2012, 2:47 pm |
Hey... Not liking this special rule either... Lost all my cars the same way... in town for ralley and gone.
im moving some phoenixs asap towards the area Philyn... can hitch ride with me. Dont intend to ever go back after unless this changes. |
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*Rev. V* Posted Sep 30, 2012, 3:19 pm |
Yep, I'm done with it too.
Had a landy there, it got jacked. Bought another, never even got to use it. Because it got jacked too. Done. |
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Necrotech Posted Sep 30, 2012, 4:12 pm |
Same reason I left.
I pulled in a Turin. Ganger was still in car. Within 5 minutes of pulling in for the rallies.... a fully loaded Turin vanishes? The "theft" system is rather broken. I quit Morgan after that mess. |
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*The X Man* Posted Sep 30, 2012, 5:02 pm |
I agree with everyone's boycott of Morgan. I have lost vehicles as well and after reading the recent posts of cars lost, I immediately checked my garage for the vehicles I brought in for the COE. I must have been the lucky one because mine were still here! Now these were not high end vehicles, (a PU and Chevalier), but all I had that I could bring/buy. I left them last night all ready to go. The purchased vehicle was never used, but when I checked the vehicle's status, it showed that it needed to be cleaned. So, did something happen to this vehicle and it was decided it wasn't worth their time to take?? All I know is once my events here are done, I will either attempt to drive them to another town or do the easy thing and sell them off to avoid any risk of loss. I just hope they stay undisturbed for for this afternoon and then no more Morgan... until the next major event twists my arm and makes me return!
Just a quick thought for Sam to consider for Morgan. Have a larger set fee for vehicles placed in a valet/storage facility that would keep them 100% safe from theft (fee could be even weekly for a valuable service such as this). Maybe even a limit to how many vehicles one person can store(say 1 or 2 max) or a maximum amount of vehicles that the facility can house (say 50 -100). To implement something like this would allow players to keep just enough of theirs vehicles in Morgan so they can engage in any activities the town has to offer without changing the way Morgan is currently set up. Just a thought Sam, just a thought
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Juris Posted Sep 30, 2012, 5:12 pm |
Yep, congrats to all the idiots who made Morgan such a PITA that no one goes there.
There are so many WORKABLE ways to make Morgan work. Town defenses are not the answer - especially three of them. Philyn had an idea that is probably workable (Build Morgan fame, don't get looted) My idea was to allow players to start town defenses But really, what is the point? The training 'bonus' is a joke - because Morgan HAS NO TRAINING FACILITIES. Compare Morgan training to SS - there is no comparison. That's why I suggested some time ago that every town have training facilities that train different skills - SS should not be the best town overall for training. |
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Joel Autobaun Posted Sep 30, 2012, 7:18 pm |
I suggested when it first started to never lose your last two (or one) car...I quickly got shouted out. I still think it would be a great PvP town...to fight over the bonus or running the town rather than the NPCs. NPCs will kick your ass everytime, they dont sleep. They steal your #### out of your garage and will red your gangers if they get a chance...can you imagine the fallout if a PLAYER did this? lmao
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted Sep 30, 2012, 8:29 pm |
There's still a Morgan?
Huh. |
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Lord Foul Posted Oct 1, 2012, 1:42 am |
I sympathize with those that lost their GOE rides this week, but you could have avoided the losses by finding out that it takes 21 hours to get to Morgan from BL and sent your squad at a time so that they would have arrived after the town defenses took place. This is how I and most likely Joel did it this week.
Many suggestions, public and private have been made to Sam about adjusting Morgan, like allowing a player to keep one chassis from being stolen ad long as there are characters there so a player can attempt to defend. Unfortunately Sam has been very busy or occupied with other things as of late. Hopefully at some point he will be able to address this. While being frustrated by the loss of chassis and equipment is legitimate, the only reason they are being lost is because no effort is being made to defend Morgan. Sure, SS training is better overall, but it is a newbie town that has spoiled everyone, including the vets with lots of skill points gained per for doing nothing. With Morgan, the players are actually presented with a "challenge" to earn bonuses to training, skill caps and suppression of training form. When participating in any of the Morgan defenses, players even have the opportunity to gain up to 5 points per skill used in a Morgan defense, up to 5 skill per used skill is quite a lot for one battle. While the defense battles are more difficult than your average scout, the can be won with proper planning and equipment. I even one a defense on my own with just one apache. One of my guys gained 5 leadership and 5 mech points just from that battle. If players actually worked together, participated in the defenses and won all 3 defenses so the training bonus was on, each player could actually acquire more skill per week than Somerset. Every town, including SS should always be worried about being attacked and it should never be an easy ride like it currently is in SS. Sam has been very kind is allowing players of all skill level to use SS as their uber training facility to get characters into the 400 skill level with little field/battle experience. |
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*JeeTeeOh* Posted Oct 1, 2012, 2:49 am |
Where's the "picking my jaw up off the floor" emoticon? I've never seen two hundred, much less four. |
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*Tinker* Posted Oct 1, 2012, 8:50 am |
I think Morgan is desperately needing a training center
One idea i had is that Morgan can be considered a settlement that grows or weakens by player involvement. If it's doing good then the training center gets better and better, and the shops start filling up with better items. Also like Joel's idea of a Boss of Morgan, the head honcho would get 1st pick in the shops like the hero point system. Maybe that can be tied into that "fame" thing people are talking about, starting with the players that most take part in town defenses, just an idea that needs fleshing out, and other factors to help that fame. With Into The Ruins maybe we can think up of some good ideas for that, plus other things i hope |
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*SirLatte* Posted Oct 1, 2012, 10:22 am |
A simple fix...would be to have the ability to rent cars at Morgan...After losing all my vehicles I have been stuck there for months...I couldnt defend | ||||||||
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Necrotech Posted Oct 1, 2012, 11:29 am |
Does not SS apply the skilling up/training brakes near that 100 point mark ?
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*Bastille* Posted Oct 1, 2012, 11:32 am |
How about some win car events in morgan or other town events? |
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Doc Death Posted Oct 1, 2012, 1:35 pm |
I would get involved more with Morgan if you got rid of the falling snow...its just annoying...I have no trouble with a snow background just the falling stuff simulated. | ||||||||
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Juris Posted Oct 1, 2012, 5:27 pm |
If |
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*Tinker* Posted Oct 1, 2012, 6:27 pm |
+1 the fog is good enough, I wouldn't mind couple snow flakes here or there, that would still work without it giving hypnotic migraines after a few minutes like right now lol |
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Philyn Posted Oct 1, 2012, 10:56 pm |
If cars disappear when you arrive and there are no cars or weapons at the mech shop it makes it very hard to defend the town. Another issue is that I would not have been able to make any of the events this last weekend due to the timing. |
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Valiance Posted Apr 16, 2017, 10:35 pm |
I know this thread is aeons old, but I am trying to get my around Morgan. Does it still follow these crazy rules, and hence is dead and pointless? Or has something changed since 2012? | ||||||||
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*The X Man* Posted Apr 17, 2017, 12:15 am |
Morgan is fine. Defenses are done 3 times per week. Many benefits here that you cannot get anywhere else in the game.
You are more than welcome to PM me once you arrive in Morgan and I can help set you up with gear to participate in the defenses or for scouting. |
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Valiance Posted Apr 17, 2017, 10:24 am |
Fair enough. I've been. Not interested in a place where my stuff can just randomly disappear. | ||||||||
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*Joskney* Posted Apr 18, 2017, 1:46 am |
By reading these threads, I must say it looks like Morgan got sacked ALOT more often then, now days. I wasn't around in the 2012 so I don't know their record but since I started 2014. I can only remember 2(3?) we lost straight up, and about 3-5 that no one showed to defend.
If you need gear/items let me know too. We pulled a pristine CC just this last weekend from loot. |
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*The X Man* Posted Apr 18, 2017, 5:04 am |
We had a stretch of consecutive successful defenses that lasted over 2 1/2 years.
But with all the perks Morgan has to offer, there always has to have a trade off of risk/reward. But IMO, the rewards are so much more worth it even if a loss (extremely rare) would happen. These items can also be relatively easy to replace thru scouting, unless you are bringing rare stuff to Morgan. Apaches with MMGs, HMGs are standard builds. All you need are decent gangers and you can have a blast in the snow. |
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Valiance Posted Apr 18, 2017, 9:55 am |
I think my problem is that Darkwind already dangerously veers into feeling like a job, with so many commitments and things to do. When I have too many missions running, it can rapidly get overwhelming.
Morgan feels the same: I fear that if I *miss* an event, then my stuff gets nicked. I don't like stuff being stolen in real life, or in a game. I suspect that feeling, that I haven't done enough to protect my stuff, will be sufficiently strong that rapid training in Morgan is not enough of a bonus. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe one day I'll try it. But for now, it's bad enough risking stuff when you are playing Darkwind. Risking it for *not* playing Darkwind feels punishing in the extreme. But thank you for trying to convince me :-) |
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*The X Man* Posted Apr 19, 2017, 6:29 am |
Whats to risk?? As the Mayor of Morgan, it is my duty to make sure all residents are safe from pirates. I do most of the defenses myself or I have a couple other players help me every week. We win, your gear is safe. Thats what happens every week. So again... whats to risk? |
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*Splurs* Posted Apr 19, 2017, 6:34 am |
I can see what Valiance is saying, and I might be able to aleviate some more of the issue.
You don't need to participate in the town defences to benifit from the bonuses, correct me if I am wrong but it is 3 out of the 5 defences that need to be won to keep the town safe? With all this as it is now, you don't have to feel pressured to play in Morgan, as X has said he does most of the town defences, along with others. I would like to get there and one day I will move some gangers there. I have been on the recieving end of not playing DW to come back to nothing in Morgan so can understand the fear of not wanting to put assets there. However I believe it is alot safer than it ever was, and if X can explain it alittle better how the whole Morgan works then it might ease more fear. |
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*The X Man* Posted Apr 19, 2017, 6:44 am |
That is the exact point. Participation is not necessary to receive the special bonuses Morgan has to offer. There are 3 defenses scheduled every week and ALL 3 MUST be successful for the bonuses to be active. |
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*Splurs* Posted Apr 19, 2017, 6:55 am |
Thats what I was trying to get to, I dont even know if most players these days know how Morgan work, it is obvious that I only have a small grip on it, hence I said if you (The X Man) was to go through it, and the way you lose assets there, then it might get people like Valiance back there.
For example, if you lose one defence do you then lose cars? Or do multiple ones need to be lost? |
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Valiance Posted Apr 19, 2017, 7:43 am |
Thank you. So does that mean that no one has lost stuff in Morgan for 2.5 years, except through scouting disasters? Or does it mean only "acceptable" losses (when it is entirely possible that my *acceptable* losses are different to yours.)
I guess I'm trying to calibrate the risk, as Splurs says. To me, it looks like "if you are nto actively involved in Morgan, you will probably lose your cars through inactivity within a week or two", which is not very appealing. But maybe I just have poor data. |
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*The X Man* Posted Apr 19, 2017, 8:19 am |
The only time you have a chance at losing any gear (when not actively playing) is on a failed defense. And even then, not every player will lose items.
Obviously, all players in the defense squad will lose their vehicles. Random players will have their vehicles, engines and/or weapons looted by pirates, but not everyone. Yes, there was a span of 2 1/2 years where every defense was successful and no player lost any gear during that time. Since that streak ended. There were 3-4 defenses lost. 2 of those were due to no one able to attend. The other ones were surrenders to avoid ganger loss. All 4 loses, I offered and replaced any gear from my own inventory that was lost by any non-defending players. That was done to help keep players active in Morgan. We also had a hospital added to the town a couple years ago because of the increased player activity in Morgan. Weekly training in Morgan is one of the best in game. Field training thru scouting and defenses is the best in game. And only in Morgan can you receive training increases over any capped skill providing all 3 defenses were successful that week. There are a lot of great maps that Bastille made for Morgan. You owe it to yourself to explore these areas. Very scenic, but more importantly, challenging combats that will make you come back for more. |
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*Bastille* Posted May 12, 2017, 9:39 am |
You give their stuff back if they gat raided!
You softy 😉 |
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*Joskney* Posted May 13, 2017, 12:21 am |
He lies... HE never replaced my 5 buzzers and 3 heavy lasers...
As an aside, we faced 26 vehicles over 3 defenses this week, 2 x cars vs. 8 on average (2 vs 8) (1+1militia vs 7) (2 vs 11) ... I got on average 3 points per skill per ganger on those 3 defenses. My Hvy Gunner went from 349 to 363. I am a muscle scouter by habit, too much running with GTO and Snipe years ago, so line fighting gets old for me, but Morgan is always a rush. |
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*The X Man* Posted May 13, 2017, 3:57 am |
I figured if you mention their name that they can't resist popping in to see what they have been missing! |
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*Bastille* Posted May 30, 2017, 11:09 am |
a lot, apparently
Id like to come back but , shhhhhhh, you didn't hear it from me |
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*Snipe* Posted Jun 18, 2017, 11:46 am |
Yeah, muscle scouting is always the best way to go.
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*The X Man* Posted Jun 18, 2017, 6:35 pm |
Oh Man!, you forget to close the barn door see all the strays that come a wondering back
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