*sam* Posted May 16, 2011, 9:12 am	Yep, we really have chainsaws! (and swords). I also put thru a code change so that when you have a melee attack scheduled, your character will track their enemy during the movement phase, so they have the best possible chance of actually being close enough to land a blow when they get to the combat phase.
*Bastille* Posted May 16, 2011, 9:24 am	...waits for revs response... thats 2000! oops went too soon... 1999
FireFly Posted May 16, 2011, 10:45 am	So both swords and chainsaws are in the game? Only found chainsaws in the shops Nevermind, found a sword
*Rev. V* Posted May 16, 2011, 12:17 pm	I'm so happy I could squirt. Does this mean that with the skins I've done, and my unceasing support of linked chain cutting devices, I get to be listed as a "contributor" now?!?!?!?
*Bastille* Posted May 16, 2011, 12:44 pm	hey hey hey, you girls might give a helping hand, but you take the contibutions. its us that makes them
*Rev. V* Posted May 16, 2011, 1:37 pm	Speaking of which, your gang owes for 37 hours of "Helping Hand".... Pay up.
FireFly Posted May 16, 2011, 2:14 pm	By the way, I'd like to add some things if you are actually going to make those "Real" gladiator style matches with swords then I would like to suggest two things... First, the one that gets to hit first should NOT be based on speed, since these weapons are so dangerous it would simply be a meta-game of who can find the fastest and toughest mutant to kill everyone with, not sure what to base it on, even make it random maybe. Second, in a case were both are holding hand weapons you should be able to "Dodge" strikes based on your dexterity, as I see it it would be as simple as a dexterity vs dexterity +/- weapon modifier (The chance never goes above 50% or so), this would certainly make combat a bit more interesting, and it might allow for a fast character to hit first this way, since speedy mutants often have poor dex... I dunno, just some ideas to make it more fun, if it's easy to do I think it would be worth your effort sam.
FireFly Posted May 16, 2011, 2:52 pm	ID 14685 MELEE!!! Now imagine that with 30 dudes... just plain awesome!
Juris Posted May 16, 2011, 4:29 pm	So how does melee work? What determines chance to attack/damage/attack speed? Are melee attacks more lethal than getting shot? They should definitely involve more bleeding...
FireFly Posted May 16, 2011, 4:32 pm	Juris, not really no, took like 6 slices with a sword to take someone down with a 50 strength character... Although the bleeding was heavy, heavy bleeding... Sadly most slice injuries just consisted of stun, no decapitations
Joel Autobaun Posted May 16, 2011, 5:01 pm	*sam* said: Yep, we really have chainsaws! (and swords). I also put thru a code change so that when you have a melee attack scheduled, your character will track their enemy during the movement phase, so they have the best possible chance of actually being close enough to land a blow when they get to the combat phase. This is great, Hammers will work too.
Snidely Carmichael Posted May 16, 2011, 5:22 pm	*sam* said: Yep, we really have chainsaws! (and swords). I also put thru a code change so that when you have a melee attack scheduled, your character will track their enemy during the movement phase, so they have the best possible chance of actually being close enough to land a blow when they get to the combat phase. Awesome, Sam, thanks.  Though I don't think anyone (besides maybe Rev) would argue that ped melee is "core" gameplay, it's amusing as hell and really enlivens the game.
*Bastille* Posted May 16, 2011, 11:27 pm	never really been sure on how melee works (never read gurps rules, is that close?), but I think FF has some good ideas there. Should definitely be some to hit roll based on dex I m guessing, and then respective dodge roll. Needle them away with accurate hits, or hack away wildly with that 137 18 67 mutant, just mind your own legs. Does dex effect criticals? Does Strength effect criticals? Does a wild swing with a high strength character leave open to attacks of opportunity? Does Goats breath smell of carrots?
*Bastille* Posted May 16, 2011, 11:28 pm	*Rev. V* said: Speaking of which, your gang owes for 37 hours of "Helping Hand".... Pay up. *Thock* one bag with 37 hands! Does that help? We have obviously much to learn about the chainsaw here at Bastille.
*sam* Posted May 17, 2011, 12:20 pm	It's not worth making much complexity here, but I agree that some improvement would be useful. How about - (1) the chance of hitting ranges from 25%-100% depending on the attacker and defender speed/dex, (2) the damage is modified slightly by strength
Joel Autobaun Posted May 17, 2011, 12:47 pm	Speed is already the king stat. Make dex the hitting range. speed requires no change, already a massive advantage if you have good speed. Make dex important in the actual hit chance somehow.
johnny go Posted May 17, 2011, 1:03 pm	I would say strength for hitting with hammers and chainsaws, dex for swords
FireFly Posted May 17, 2011, 1:27 pm	I also want to add, it seems a sub 40 strength ganger can only cause "Minor concussion" damage with a hammer and no criticals.
Joel Autobaun Posted May 17, 2011, 1:38 pm	johnny go said: I would say strength for hitting with hammers and chainsaws, dex for swords No
*Rev. V* Posted May 17, 2011, 2:01 pm	Yeah, that throws things too much towards the muties if you use STR.
*sam* Posted May 17, 2011, 6:26 pm	*Rev. V* said: Yeah, that throws things too much towards the muties if you use STR. Would you like to get into a fist-fight with a mutie?
FireFly Posted May 17, 2011, 6:36 pm	*sam* said: *Rev. V* said: Yeah, that throws things too much towards the muties if you use STR. Would you like to get into a fist-fight with a mutie? I wouldn't want to, that's for sure  As a side note sam, did you have a look at what was causing the issues with the slash damage table? I haven't checked today, but I'm not sure I want to see cut arms and a leg that's been cut off show as a "Stun" injury. And a guy was cut 8 or so times in an event with a sword and got about 7 stun injures and a deeply cut leg to show for it... Just sayin'
*Rev. V* Posted May 17, 2011, 7:31 pm	"Would you like to get into a fist-fight with a mutie? " IRL I have had 2 occasions where similar things have occured....some folks are *just* shy of "mutant" status! But- Strength does not automatically equal the agility to use it properly. Just because you're strong, doesn't mean you can dance about like a ballerina....which is why I'm still walking around after those 2 occasions. If someone can squash you like a grape, don't throw yourself into the grape press!
FireFly Posted May 17, 2011, 8:11 pm	Well, hence why you give the High Dex characthers a chanse to dodge... Just make sure to cap it so we dont get super agility people
*sam* Posted May 18, 2011, 8:41 am	FireFly said: *sam* said: *Rev. V* said: Yeah, that throws things too much towards the muties if you use STR. Would you like to get into a fist-fight with a mutie? I wouldn't want to, that's for sure  As a side note sam, did you have a look at what was causing the issues with the slash damage table? I haven't checked today, but I'm not sure I want to see cut arms and a leg that's been cut off show as a "Stun" injury. And a guy was cut 8 or so times in an event with a sword and got about 7 stun injures and a deeply cut leg to show for it... Just sayin'  That's just the short-term descriptions, yeah. I think you'll find after 10 turns or so it would switch to a more meaningful description (when the short term effects turn into long term). However, I'll edit the short term descriptions..
*Tinker* Posted May 18, 2011, 8:52 am	I think it's high time to revisit dex both for gunnery and hand weapon accuracy and dodging, " float like a butterfly, sting like a bee" ... agegegege...
Zephyr Posted May 20, 2011, 7:33 pm	Excellent news. Can't wait to try them out.