*sam* Posted Nov 5, 2009, 8:48 am	I'm just putting the finishing touches to the following and testing them before patching. This is fundamentally a revert to our old pvp model which allowed pvp attacks in any town except for SS. It also includes some extra client functions to make the actual logistics of doing an attack easier. 1. Every town except SS is now once again considered ‘open pvp’. This means you can attack other squads regardless of their camp affiliation or war status. There is no longer a special clause for low-rep players at SS: even they cannot be attacked there. 2. If you are a member of a camp that’s at war with a camp who someone in the enemy squad is a member of, you will continue to earn fame for your camp in the pvp combat 3. All wilderness pvp provides accelerated field training 4. As well as the existing ability to monitor a specific town’s gates, you’ll now find a new option when you click any player from the lobby list: “spy on squads”: this means you’ll get a notification when any squad they own is arriving/leaving a town, and will be given an option to intercept them. You’ll be given a list of your own squads in that town from which to pick. Your chosen squad will be set straight into 'scouting' mode with the enemy squad as their designated enemy. Your squad will automatically use CR balancing in the combat if it happens. 5. PvP attacks can be avoided with a successful scouting roll. In effect, you always have at least a 50% chance of escaping a pvp attack, and this goes up to 80%+ with a good scout. 6. In wilderness pvp combats:   (i) you auto-succeed jury-rigging tests (mech skill is assumed to be 500, which means any undestroyed engine at zero health can be jury-rigged)   (ii) you auto-succeed all feasible first aid rolls (first aid skill assumed to be 500, so anyone still alive with anything short of a severed jugular should be save-able).   (iii) the losing side’s footsquad automatically gets home without any creature combats
FireFly Posted Nov 5, 2009, 9:43 am	I like these changes... better watch my back now
*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Nov 5, 2009, 10:14 am	This all sounds intriguing
*Tinker* Posted Nov 5, 2009, 11:31 am	War.... War never changes.... COOL Sam!
*goat starer* Posted Nov 5, 2009, 1:55 pm	menu firefly burgers with chips fireflies on toast firefly suprise
*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Nov 5, 2009, 2:02 pm	Awww you are evil
Marrkos Posted Nov 5, 2009, 3:44 pm	When doing the spying thing, can you only spy on a single player at a time?
*sam* Posted Nov 5, 2009, 3:53 pm	Marrkos said: When doing the spying thing, can you only spy on a single player at a time? no
Marrkos Posted Nov 5, 2009, 4:06 pm	Is there an indication in the player list of who is being spied on? Yes, this is an oblique bump at getting other indications in the player list as well, i.e. ignored status, war status, spied status, scouting squad set up (?).
*sam* Posted Nov 5, 2009, 4:15 pm	Marrkos said: Is there an indication in the player list of who is being spied on? Yes, this is an oblique bump at getting other indications in the player list as well, i.e. ignored status, war status, spied status, scouting squad set up (?).  No indication, no. But you're right, I need to look at this. Done entirely through colour, or maybe better with single-letter tags such as?: I = ignored W = war E = enemy/spied S = scouting
Marrkos Posted Nov 5, 2009, 4:18 pm	I'd go with letters (or icons if you want to get tricky) and avoid the whole colorblind issue.
*sam* Posted Nov 5, 2009, 4:21 pm	Getting icons to play nicely with those text-lists could be tricky, so yeah, letters :-)
simonmaxhill Posted Nov 5, 2009, 4:23 pm	The war indicator would be especially useful. One of the problems during the brief camp wars I did was simply not knowing who I was at war with.
Karz Master Posted Nov 5, 2009, 4:31 pm	*Grograt* said: Awww you are evil /me gasps for breath while laughing.
Fealty Lost Posted Nov 5, 2009, 4:48 pm	Can't wait. Love the 40K box thingie... ...and the Mad Max quote. Keep it up Sam! Kudos!
FireFly Posted Nov 5, 2009, 4:58 pm	Just to clarify, for someone to attack you on a return, you have to actually get a return right?
*sam* Posted Nov 5, 2009, 6:57 pm	FireFly said: Just to clarify, for someone to attack you on a return, you have to actually get a return right? Yes. Scouting and gates events are basically spawned once every few minutes, so when you indicate on the website that you're ready to do one, your squad is put into a 'holding' list. If you 'process arrival' and get no encounter, you never join the holding list. When the holding list is processed, any squads that are looking for pvp (and sometimes ones that aren't) may be matched against others. The squads are processed in random order so no-one gets an unfair advantage in terms of avoiding or achieving pvp combats. This random order is the reason that you always have a minimum of 50% chance of avoiding pvp if you don't want to do it. If there's no appropriate human adversary for your squad, you get an NPC (pve) enounter Mid-travel encounters are different: they are spawned more frequently and never take the form of pvp combats. It's the holding list that's being queried by the new 'spy' facility (and the monitor gates facility)
*Longo* Posted Nov 5, 2009, 7:30 pm	Can you put in a toggle switch somewhere that allows us to set what camp gets our PVP fame?
Joel Autobaun Posted Nov 5, 2009, 7:44 pm	Longo said: Can you put in a toggle switch somewhere that allows us to set what camp gets our PVP fame? +1 this.
metrocube Posted Nov 5, 2009, 7:46 pm	Longo said: Can you put in a toggle switch somewhere that allows us to set what camp gets our PVP fame? Seconded.  Past combats have shown that the camp that gets the pvp fame for an encounter is seemingly random. We need a way to specify on which camps behalf we are fighting. Especially as many of us have multiple camp allegiances.
Iron Wraith Posted Nov 5, 2009, 8:54 pm	Just to clarify. Leaving and entering SS I cannot encounter PvP. Entering/exiting any oher town, my chance of encounter isn't significantly different to currently. If a player is monitoring my gang they can choose to intercept which would replace the PvE encounter I would have otherwise encountered. The encounter will be balanced to my CR (so if I have a single car with CR < 200, I would get the standard CR 250 encounter. If I run like a girl and escape, I get extra skill ups and all my opponent gets is them pesky gate fees to pay. If I fail to escape I am highly likley to get home safe (though there are no guarantees). If all these are correct I think there are sufficient counter incentives to not disadvantage my preferred play style.
Joel Autobaun Posted Nov 5, 2009, 10:54 pm	You preferred play style is PvE? I would say you have no problem. Also if you don't want to bother running away you can pay a bounty and truce the encounter. I assume that is still an option. Worst case scenario if you surrender before breach every time, is just losing the cars and never your gangers. It's "safer" than fighting NPCs.
Groove Champion Posted Nov 5, 2009, 11:05 pm	These are very sensible changes, Sam. Although there isn't really an advantage to PVPing, these changes certainly put PvP on an even playing ground with PVE. I hope this works out!
Lord Foul Posted Nov 6, 2009, 12:40 am	Quote: 5. PvP attacks can be avoided with a successful scouting roll. In effect, you always have at least a 50% chance of escaping a pvp attack, and this goes up to 80%+ with a good scout. Would it be possible to have a button/box to accept all pvp attacks to bypass the scout roll? Maybe have the option attached to each squad you create?
*Ayjona* Posted Nov 6, 2009, 2:10 am	I really wasn't expecting a return to the old PvP system, even though I was advocating it. And, with these new changes, the system seems more feasible than ever. Thanks, Sam!
*sam* Posted Nov 6, 2009, 8:17 am	Quote: Can you put in a toggle switch somewhere that allows us to set what camp gets our PVP fame? Noted. Quote: Would it be possible to have a button/box to accept all pvp attacks to bypass the scout roll? Maybe have the option attached to each squad you create? OK. I'm actually just about to remove the info. you get about the 'time until spawn' when spying, since that's really too much info. and could be exploited by either pvpers or those trying to avoid it for their own benefit
*sam* Posted Nov 6, 2009, 8:23 am	Iron Wraith said: Just to clarify. Leaving and entering SS I cannot encounter PvP. correct Iron Wraith said: Entering/exiting any oher town, my chance of encounter isn't significantly different to currently. If you mean any encounter, then there's no change at all in terms of likelihood. In terms of pvp encounters rather than pve, it's increased somewhat since the logistics of seeking pvp have been improved. Iron Wraith said: If a player is monitoring my gang they can choose to intercept which would replace the PvE encounter I would have otherwise encountered. yes Iron Wraith said: The encounter will be balanced to my CR (so if I have a single car with CR < 200, I would get the standard CR 250 encounter. It's balanced, yes. The enemy will be within a certain percentage above or below your CR, not necessarily above it (unlike with pve). Iron Wraith said: If I run like a girl and escape, I get extra skill ups and all my opponent gets is them pesky gate fees to pay. It depends if any damage is done. I should have pointed that out: skill bonuses in pvp events do require an actual combat (otherwise this could easily be exploited by friends). Iron Wraith said: If I fail to escape I am highly likley to get home safe (though there are no guarantees). Yes. Worst case is a footsquad with no creature encounters. If you take bad damage your chance of bleeding to death is vastly reduced. (If you were killed outright in the combat I can't save you).
*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Nov 6, 2009, 11:20 am	Just a small point, this roll back has kinda made shanty redundant, an plans for its future
*Ayjona* Posted Nov 6, 2009, 12:05 pm	*Grograt* said: Just a small point, this roll back has kinda made shanty redundant, an plans for its future I wouldn't say that any kind of expansions to the world of Darkwind are redundant, especially not new cities and villages, even if that particular city does not feature a different gaming mechanic. Why, if that was the case, only Firelight, and one of Elmsfield, Badlands, Gateway, and Texan should remain... (Firelight is pirate-focused, and since Somerset does not allows free PvP, one other plains city should remain, to allow free PvP, but without the pirate mechanics of Firelight. Thus, we'd have three cities, all with a clear purpose, in terms of gameplay implications and mechanics.)
*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Nov 6, 2009, 12:18 pm	but it was opened to counter the lack of PVP due to un used camp wars system, we now have PVP rolled back with a better looking system so shantys conception has been negated. With no npc market and no player support ( i myself and a good few others have pulled out of shanty ) it will be as under used if not more so than Elms, it also imo needs a niche of its own, the RP idea behind shanty is very sound maybe we could broaden the towns gypsy leanings ?
*Ayjona* Posted Nov 6, 2009, 1:12 pm	*Grograt* said: but it was opened to counter the lack of PVP due to un used camp wars system, we now have PVP rolled back with a better looking system so shantys conception has been negated. With no npc market and no player support ( i myself and a good few others have pulled out of shanty ) it will be as under used if not more so than Elms, it also imo needs a niche of its own, the RP idea behind shanty is very sound maybe we could broaden the towns gypsy leanings ? Yes, I'm all for broadening its concept, and giving it a conceptual niche. Good idea, with the gypsy tone. But it has a lot of value as another Darkwind settlement as well, in-canon- and story-wise, even if not expanded. As for Elms, it is my favourite Darkwind city, and during my active periods, I regularily scout from it. Evan is still a rather small open world simulation. While a 100 000+ star systems gaming universe might not make the players cheer with joy if another system is added, so far, every new village in Darkwind makes a difference.
*sam* Posted Nov 6, 2009, 2:38 pm	I'm open to suggestions for shantyville's future!
Marrkos Posted Nov 6, 2009, 3:00 pm	*sam* said: I'm open to suggestions for shantyville's future! Could it be used to test market restrictions, i.e. item X is only available in Shanty so players have to either get there to buy it, or rely on other players to ship it North? Don't know what 'item X' would be.....maybe a Gatling Gun that's been modified to be a Medium Gatling Gun, or something else that wouldn't require the RP to involve the complete manufacture of the item.
*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Nov 6, 2009, 3:18 pm	Agreed *Ayjona* we certainly love our new towns and shanty maps are great, just the lack of impetus to be there at present is a downer, i like marrkos idea of a special market place allowing for ' gypsy / rogue trader type one of equipment as in the MGG ( also a great way to introduce new weapons and check for game balance if only a few are releasd ) but of course a system ( fair ) of obtaining these items would need to be put in place, just camping a member in town and scanning the market every five seconds, shouldn't allow for the purchase of these items ( what ever they may be ) Tell you what ill open another thread eh  and quote what we have already *EDIT* NEW THREAD Shanty Ville : A new beginning
Desert Fox Posted Nov 21, 2009, 9:44 pm	I really think these changes are crap... sigh Fox
Marrkos Posted Nov 21, 2009, 10:09 pm	Desert Fox said: I really think these changes are crap...  sigh Fox Why?
Barbu Posted Nov 21, 2009, 10:20 pm	I personally finds those changes more realistic and intriguing. It should open up the possibilities between players. Marrkos said: Desert Fox said: I really think these changes are crap...  sigh Fox Why? Yes I also think that this lacks a bit of elaboration.
darthspanky Posted Nov 22, 2009, 4:41 am	maybe in shanty town when someone looses a pvp on shanty maps they can be sold or ransomed automaticaly caught by pvp winner? with per gang rep faction maybe enemy npc faction would bid on captured pc guys as well?
FireFly Posted Nov 22, 2009, 12:21 pm	For as long as you dont change shanty to much, I'm happy, its a special town, let it be (although the unbalanced CR suggestion has merit)
Big Daddy Posted Nov 24, 2009, 2:48 am	Has anyone played either side in this new pvp system? I haven't, I'm curious to hear about it or see a replay. It seems like the ambusher must have a huge advantage - a damaged opponent, possibly hoping to sneak some presumably weakened loot past the less clever NPC gangs. Plus, it seems the ambusher has a fairly easy ability to scope out likely opponents. That apparently just worked in my favor as a veteran was scoping out my encounter and saw me get careless at the end and took pity on my very weakened squad. Is there something about the CR balancing that compensates for breached armor and damaged weapons or engines?
simonmaxhill Posted Nov 24, 2009, 8:51 am	It used to be that there was a much worse chance of catching someone on the way back into town than on the way out. It may even be that you can't catch people on a return, but I'm not really clear on it. My personal experience with the new PvP is that I have yet to catch anyone on the road and haven't seen any incidents yet in a few weeks. I've started to think of it as "pPvP", where the first "p" stands for "potential." It's a largely academic portion of DW gameplay, at least for now - and by "academic" I do mean, "lots of discussion, no action." Like my sex life!
*Ninesticks* Posted Nov 24, 2009, 9:27 am	I think we are still at the foreplay stage. I know *cough* that some intercepts have been attempted.
*Grograt* gary.r.horder@gmail.com Posted Nov 24, 2009, 10:53 am	IS IT WORKING as i have attempted at least five intercepts all to no avail, has ANYBODY actually managed to hold a squad and attack ?
simonmaxhill Posted Nov 24, 2009, 4:55 pm	I have yet to succcessfully intercept, but I've definitely missed a lot of opportunities... I think. Is it possible to intercept a traveling squad on their arrival? Is it possible to intercept a scouting squad on their return? Those are questions on my mind.
FireFly Posted Nov 24, 2009, 6:17 pm	Simon, from what I know, there is a 50% chance of interception
simonmaxhill Posted Nov 24, 2009, 7:28 pm	I think there's a much lower chance of interception if you fail to checkbox the "auto-balance CR". I am a moron!
*sam* Posted Nov 25, 2009, 11:02 am	simonmaxhill said: I think there's a much lower chance of interception if you fail to checkbox the "auto-balance CR". I am a moron! No, I'm the moron. I found a bug that was stopping the whole system working. Now fixed (needs to be verified). BTW auto-balancing is automatically applied if you target a specific enemy squad rather than go out looking for any pvp target. No need to check the checkbox.
simonmaxhill Posted Nov 25, 2009, 7:54 pm	PvPs now spawn. I can't exactly call it a "success" from my end, but just having the chance to send rockets winging after another players car as it sped away felt pretty magical.
*sam* Posted Nov 25, 2009, 8:36 pm	Sorry again for the bug... the whole coding around this area is very hard to 'field test'..
darthspanky Posted Dec 5, 2009, 2:10 am	dont worry il help ya field test it
*sam* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 12:34 am	darthspanky said: dont worry il help ya field test it
FireFly Posted Dec 8, 2009, 7:16 am	I have a slight question, aren't you supposed to be able to get back without a return if you get hit by pvp? Goat hit me once in firelight, after kicking his arse, I had a return encounter, in witch he tried again to intercept me (failed, that time)
*sam* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 9:48 am	FireFly said: I have a slight question, aren't you supposed to be able to get back without a return if you get hit by pvp? Goat hit me once in firelight, after kicking his arse,  I had a return encounter, in witch he tried again to intercept me (failed, that time) The losing side's footsquad gets back without an encounter, but the winning side's squad may (currently) have a gates return. This could be changed of course.
FireFly Posted Dec 8, 2009, 10:30 am	Well, its just that, even if we have a perfect chanse to juryrig, it wont matter if we get returns right?
*sam* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 10:33 am	That's true yeah. Unless there's any potential exploits I have no problem changing this... can anyone else think of any arguments against?
*goat starer* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 11:30 am	i dont have any arguments against.. because I dont eunderstand a word of what FF is wittering about... but you should be subject to a potential return if you are on the winning side or if you escape in PVP in exactly the same way as you are in normal scouting. If you are worried about returns then dont take shot up vehicles.... its unrealistic to expect you can drive a heap of junk back into Firelight without running a risk of being jumped... Indeed you should be MORE likely to get a PVP return after a PVP event because the people you just beat will be radioing back for support. And sam you have still not fixed the recall exploit that FF is so fond of.
FireFly Posted Dec 8, 2009, 11:37 am	Goat, I used it once, because I simply didnt have time to fight you, I think that is a resonable enough reason, those other times, remember the CR balancing goat? It's hard to intercept a 177cr BPU (Even less if I took some armor damage) with a 300 - 350cr Buzzer, might want to rethink your setups eh?
*goat starer* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 11:42 am	FireFly said: Goat, I used it once, because I simply didnt have time to fight you, I think that is a resonable enough reason, those other times, remember the CR balancing goat? It's hard to intercept a 177cr BPU (Even less if I took some armor damage) with a 300 - 350cr Buzzer, might want to rethink your setups eh? FF.. you had time enough to head out on a FL scout where you will have to fight 4 AI cars but not 1 of me? that is nonsense.. you ahve done it repeatedly to avoid PVP... and you had 2 cars the second time unless you left that junker landy behind so the CR matching was right. You really strugglke with basic stuff in this game old bean. bugger off back to SS if you dont want to play with the grown ups
FireFly Posted Dec 8, 2009, 12:16 pm	I left the junker behind, unless its buzzer rare or perfectly mint, I never loot anything in FL, and you know why it takes me longer to fight you than 4 npc cars, simple, the npc is predictable, you arent. I play with plenty of grown up's, wish the people I played against was... And no, I havent done it repedetly, you just missed me, try lighter cars maybe, or realize that there is only a 50% chanse of interception in the first place, you can go back to SS goat, or just stick in BL were you love it so, now, this is not what this thread was for, so lets take this another time shal we?
*goat starer* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 1:24 pm	Firefly you are hilarious.. but not in a good way At least make some effort to speak English.. its bad enough trying to understand Darth. Just admit it.. you want to run around FL like so many other players of the gamewithout ever exposing yourself to any risk... If you dont like the dangerous bits that go play back in the ball pool.
*Ninesticks* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 7:06 pm	In all fairness you should still get the chance of having a return as per normal - I don't see why that should be avoidable (though I am willing to be convinced). Regarding the recall exploit, it really is that - an exploit. If you have time to send a scout out as per normal then you have to take the chance of getting caught in a PvP. Additionally with a PvP you have the option of paying the bounty to avoid the fight - for whatever reason. Recalling your squad to avoid a possible PvP just wastes the other player's time and effort (which I think is just plain rude to be honest).
Serephe Posted Dec 8, 2009, 7:09 pm	*Ninesticks* said: Regarding the recall exploit, it really is that - an exploit. If you have time to send a scout out as per normal then you have to take the chance of getting caught in a PvP. Additionally with a PvP you have the option of paying the bounty to avoid the fight - for whatever reason. Recalling your squad to avoid a possible PvP just wastes the other player's time and effort (which I think is just plain rude to be honest). Seconding this. Exploits really get my goat.
FireFly Posted Dec 8, 2009, 7:15 pm	Well, recalling your squad is something you cant really fix thou, unless you want to make it impossible to recall them to begin with, and that's no good, its easy to forget ammo and press recall at the last second. And about the "Calling for backup", as in, vengefull return, that is not good game balance, there is not many people who could survive 2 PvP encounters in 1 go. And me sticking to FL because it is without risk, you must be joking goat, I run trough Texan and shanty on a regular basis now, check your info before you talk trash. And insulting my English are we, well, you better go get some glasses then, because everyone else can understand me just fine. Why do you have to make everything so personal?
Jety Posted Dec 8, 2009, 7:26 pm	What about after a PVP you have a chance of an NPC return, but not a second PVP? I agree that surviving two PVPs in a row is a bit much to expect, and we're trying to make PVP more palatable, not less.
*goat starer* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 7:36 pm	FireFly said: Well, recalling your squad is something you cant really fix thou, unless you want to make it impossible to recall them to begin with, and that's no good, its easy to forget ammo and press recall at the last second. yes you can .. you can fix it by making it impossibleto recall once a squad has been delayed and YOU can fix it by not doing it. FireFly said: And about the "Calling for backup" radios dont work during strong aurora activity. FireFly said: And me sticking to FL because it is without risk, you must be joking goat, I run trough Texan and shanty on a regular basis now, check your info before you talk trash. as most players will tell you there is very little risk fighting AI anywhere. and your english was vaguely incomprehensible which makes it very hard to have a sensible discussion with you even if that were possible in the first place  FireFly said: Why do you have to make everything so personal? because you are a rather unpleasant young man... and it is personal
*goat starer* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 7:37 pm	Jety said: What about after a PVP you have a chance of an NPC return, but not a second PVP? I agree that surviving two PVPs in a row is a bit much to expect, and we're trying to make PVP more palatable, not less. nope.. you can pay out the second one if you are in trouble. You have an automatic get out of jail free (ish) card in PVP so its no worse than an NPC return (especially in FL where you cant escape to town)
*sam* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 8:31 pm	Quote: because you are a rather unpleasant young man... and it is personal goat, cool it.. please.
*sam* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 8:41 pm	Breaking news, darth has re-subbed. Lock up your children!
Serephe Posted Dec 8, 2009, 8:55 pm	There goes the neighborhood.
*sam* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 8:57 pm	Quote: you can fix it by making it impossible to recall once a squad has been delayed I have just implemented this, BTW. I had been meaning to for several weeks but never got around to it until now.
*Rezeak* reecestensel@hotmail.co.uk Posted Dec 8, 2009, 9:32 pm	Well I wasnt here when darth used to play... but i've heard things... terrible things... :shivers:
*Longo* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 10:30 pm	I heard his first scout back, he lost to the Hyenas....
*goat starer* Posted Dec 8, 2009, 11:40 pm	darth is a pussycat.... lots of people think he is is a tiger... but actually he is just closer than they think.
darthspanky Posted Dec 9, 2009, 6:52 am	first thing i did was move 18 guys to bl so i can kick goats butt thats my motivation, meow
victor victor Posted Dec 9, 2009, 8:14 am	*Ninesticks* said: In all fairness you should still get the chance of having a return as per normal - I don't see why that should be avoidable (though I am willing to be convinced). Regarding the recall exploit, it really is that - an exploit. If you have time to send a scout out as per normal then you have to take the chance of getting caught in a PvP. Additionally with a PvP you have the option of paying the bounty to avoid the fight - for whatever reason. Recalling your squad to avoid a possible PvP just wastes the other player's time and effort (which I think is just plain rude to be honest).
*goat starer* Posted Dec 9, 2009, 9:26 am	darthspanky said: first thing i did was move 18 guys to bl so i can kick goats butt thats my motivation,  meow ooooooooo    scary
darthspanky Posted Dec 9, 2009, 10:47 pm	pretty soon hell be asking gro and ivan to come back so they can protect him loosing a pvp to a noob in event 158850 goat you should be ashamed doesnt seem it will be hard at all i shoulda just hired a few mutants they probly could have killedc his guys, or firefly is out there hes a goatkiller
Iffler Posted Dec 9, 2009, 11:27 pm	darthspanky said: pretty soon hell be asking gro and ivan to come back so they can protect him loosing a pvp to a noob in event 158850 goat you should be ashamed doesnt seem it will be hard at all i shoulda just hired a few mutants they probly could have killedc his guys, or firefly is out there hes a goatkiller Punctuation is not usually deemed to be optional when you want other people to have a clue what you just wrote.
*Burden* Posted Dec 10, 2009, 12:32 am	Iffler said: Punctuation is not usually deemed to be optional when you want other people to have a clue what you just wrote. Agreed. Your complete lack of punctuation and grammar is probably the biggest reason why people dont take you seriously.
darthspanky Posted Dec 10, 2009, 4:54 am	goat understands, its translations..... its really a secret code to prevent noobs from? understanding, what i just......wrote? oops forgot my capital letters ILL TRY TO DO BETTER NEXT TIME IF I DONT FORGET TO TURN CAPS..LOCK OFF? thats better
Zoltan Posted Dec 10, 2009, 4:59 am	I've PVP'ed Darth before, and I'd take him seriously bad grammar and all.
Karz Master Posted Dec 10, 2009, 6:16 am	wait till my ganger gets good gunnery i will pvp you again darth we will meet each other in the wastelands again mwahaha
*goat starer* Posted Dec 13, 2009, 11:56 pm	Iffler said: darthspanky said: pretty soon hell be asking gro and ivan to come back so they can protect him loosing a pvp to a noob in event 158850 goat you should be ashamed doesnt seem it will be hard at all i shoulda just hired a few mutants they probly could have killedc his guys, or firefly is out there hes a goatkiller Punctuation is not usually deemed to be optional when you want other people to have a clue what you just wrote. I understand darth perfectly.... i do a lot of work in primary schools
darthspanky Posted Dec 14, 2009, 3:55 am	now i understand why goats so gullible i bet those 5 yr olds get over on him all the time. hes the teacher they all make fun of i bet WE DONT NEED NO EDUMINATION yer just a stone in a tall building or wall or something?
Mad Mike Posted Dec 14, 2009, 4:42 am	I see those worried about punctuation doesnt realize lack of punctuation and spelling is darths trademark and his run on sentences are also the way he talks so if you dont understand just read it again youll see what he is talking about. the way he talks only is a way for him to make you think he can not be taken seriously. darth and i were the original pirates of darkwind and all those that follow are only following in our footsteps. darth is also the only one whose original gang, the empire, is an npc gang in elmsfield because darth left them as their leader because darth wanted to turn good (not for very long) and the gang wanted to stay pirates. bounty hunters were also called into somerset because darth and I stole from the traders so much the other players couldnt stop us. its funny they were saying they couldnt pvp us in somerset and a heavy machine gun was 7K.. I think its higher now. anyway welcome back darth, good to have you back.
Marrkos Posted Dec 14, 2009, 4:47 am	Mad Mike said: darth is also the only one whose original gang, the empire, is an npc gang... Actually, viKKing's old gang Road Ronins is now a Bounty Hunter gang.
darthspanky Posted Dec 14, 2009, 6:32 am	i know how pvp changed its all verbal harassment by the represenatives of the game ohhh i get it now they want us to hunt the marshals or we can treat em all like jd thats must be what thay want it. i dont know about the rest of ya but ill play there pvp game they use threads and bribes we do wilderness pvp surprizes as soon as they have the balls to leave ss. if a marshal sees me pvp and ya got noobs and yer not jd i might give ya back some of the bounty payment, but if you do see me id pay, run, or shoot to kill if i were you. cause thats how we play
*sam* Posted Dec 14, 2009, 11:21 am	darth- you're the one doing most of the verbal harassment. Please stop.
FireFly Posted Dec 14, 2009, 11:25 am	darthspanky said: loosing a pvp to a noob in event 158850 goat you should be ashamed doesnt seem it will be hard at all i shoulda just hired a few mutants they probly could have killedc his guys, or firefly is out there hes a goatkiller I'm not a goatkiller... not yet anyway, but goat did overestimate his firelight ability, landrunner vs BPU in firelight, pfft, how silly
ISHOULDCOCO Posted Dec 14, 2009, 12:44 pm	158850 I watched this - good fair fight. Could have gone either way. I did expect FF to clip the ground with an RL round ( he is careless like that) But he held the high ground and Goat could not get his weak armour out of arc at the end. Good fight , not 'grudgey' , no one died , no massive loss of gang resources COCO
FireFly Posted Dec 14, 2009, 1:07 pm	ISHOULDCOCO said: I did expect FF to clip the ground with an RL round ( he is careless like that) Yeah... I do that to much... ever wondered how one of my firelight guys lost an ear?
simonmaxhill Posted Dec 14, 2009, 4:57 pm	I've now had two PvP experiences with a winner and a loser and in both cases I believe there were no character fatalities either due to surrender or a sense of fair play. Larger, more intense situations and camp assaults may have a higher chance of character murder, but so far it doesn't look like people are losing more than vehicles.